America and us

caricatured, above, by anti-Star Wars protesters in London recently.

THE Americans rather like the British, says Raymond Seitz. Then he spoils it by adding, almost as an afterthought: but we don't really know very much about you. That's a back-handed sort of complement, I point out, half in jest.

He laughs down the phone. He had not intended it in that way: simply that the British know far more about America than most Americans know about Britain.

"If you live in Kansas city and open the pages of the local newspaper, you won't get any stories about Britain," he says. "Here, in most newspapers, there's always a story about the US. There's ER on TV, and Frasier. Definitely the judgements here are more informed in a way.

"In the US, experience of the UK is fairly limited. We come here for a holiday, watch the changing of the guard, say it's perfectly delightful.

"We say the British are good actors, they are good fighters, they are great spies - and they are very quaint. There is a tendency in the US to fictionalise Britain, and not, I think, in a way the British themselves would find flattering. In a 19th century, almost costume drama way."

The British attitude towards America, he admits, is both more informed and more ambivalent.

"There is admiration, and I think the broad perception is rather favourable. But you do run across some British who go to the US and don't like it. They think it's too rude, too fast, too coarse. It doesn't have an NHS, it doesn't have a social security system."

Nevertheless, many Brits - "I would suggest a majority", he says - find the US a stimulating place to be. "It's fast-paced, wide-open, semi-chaotic, kind of fresh.

"Thomas Jefferson said the best government is lean government. Most Americans still pretty much feel that way. But there is a rough edge."

I'm talking to Mr Seitz, who was US ambassador to Britain between 1991 and 1994, because later this week he will be visiting York and North Yorkshire to take part in the Ryedale Festival.

On Friday evening he will be at York Minster to read quotes from Abraham Lincoln during a performance of a work by American composer Aaron Copland.

The following morning he will be attending a literary lunch at the Worsley Arms at Hovingham, where he will talk about his best-selling book: Over Here: an American's view of Britain.

The interview has to be by telephone, because he is a busy man - but even just listening to the sound of his voice is interesting.

His accent is hard to place: American, certainly, but not strong. Clipped, educated, possibly East Coast. There is something in his voice - calm, unhurried, carrying the ring of utter conviction and authority - that is peculiarly American. British people never sound like that. He's extremely courteous but it is as though somewhere, deep down, he knows the world belongs to America and the Americans can really do what they want with it. Which, of course, in a very real sense it does, and they can.

The former diplomat, who now works for a US investment bank in London, is great on the subtle (and sometimes not so subtle) differences between British and American culture.

When he first came to Britain he was struck by how much seemed familiar, at least on the surface. "It ranged from the democratic form of government to the McDonalds on the corner, the American movies at the cinema to familiar TV shows and rock'n'roll.

"But it's deceptive. It takes a little while to unravel that while many things may seem familiar, there are many things which are different."

The system of government, for a start. In the UK, he says, power is very centralised. In the States, with its federal system and presidency balanced against Congress, power is more widely spread. There, sovereignty starts at the bottom and rises upwards.

In principle maybe: but are ordinary Americans really that empowered compared to ordinary British people? In the US, he says, there is every imaginable race, religion and language. Yet every US citizen has one thing in common. "Absolutely everybody can quote the constitution." A sore point, since we don't actually have one.

There are other differences. Americans, he says, are fascinated by the British Royal Family: but don't really understand it. He recalls a visit by the Queen to Texas. As ambassador to Britain, he was in the Queen's entourage. "I remember looking out of the window. The Americans who had turned out to see her could not have been warmer - but also I saw a look on their faces of puzzlement."

The British are renowned for their reserve. He dismisses the view of us as cold as a stereotype. "But I do hear from Americans who come here who feel isolated. They move into a house, they don't know the neighbours, and there is never any welcoming gesture.

"It's quite different in the States. If you move into a house, your neighbour will be on your door with a casserole that night!" For all his courtesy, he doesn't mince words over political differences between the two countries.

The notion of a 'special relationship' he dismisses as "too sentimental". "It is a remarkably intimate relationship, but the phrase suggests a kind of relationship which is not appropriate."

In some quarters Britain is seen as too much of an American hanger-on, I say. Shouldn't we be throwing our lot in more with Europe?

We should be doing both, he says briskly. "Britain's unique role is to translate the US in Europe and Europe in the US." On the subject of George W Bush he becomes most prickly.

The British press, he says, tend to caricature US Presidents. "There was the actor from California, Ronald Reagan the peanut farmer from Georgia Jimmy Carter. Now it is the guy who's not too bright from Texas."

But Bush, he says, is much smarter than we think. And while his election may have been controversial, he still had more of the popular vote than Tony Blair did here.

On Son Of Star Wars, he insists Bush is entirely right to stress the need for change. Referring to the anti-ballistic missile treaty the US president is keen to tear up, he says: "Bush is absolutely right to say that the idea that we continue to have Cold War assets when there is no longer a cold war is fatal."

Whether or not Son Of Star Wars itself is the right solution the Europeans, whose 'knee-jerk' reaction was just to say no, no, no, must recognise the need for change in a changing world, he says.

He admits Bush got it wrong on Kyoto - but even there, he insists, European governments, despite their rhetoric, have hardly distinguished themselves when it comes to actually doing anything about climate change.

Despite his forthright views, however, he remains unfailingly courteous to the end. Winding up the interview, I thank him for finding time to talk to me.

"I enjoyed the conversation," he says - and I almost believe he means it.

Updated: 10:48 Wednesday, July 25, 2001