Safety scheme suggested for University Road in York

Safety scheme suggested for road at university

Safety scheme suggested for road at university

First published in News

A SERIES of safety improvements – including a new crossing, the relocation of a bus stop and a 20mph zone – is being proposed for University Road in York.

Cabinet member Coun Dave Merrett is being asked to approve the City of York Council scheme in principle at a decision session next week.

The scheme will be part-funded by the University of York and the council, with the former contributing approximately £150,000 towards off-highway works and the latter allocating £175,000 for the cycle route, although a recent estimate predicts that the scheme is more likely to cost in the region of £230,000.

The proposals include the relocation of an eastbound bus stop to a position closer to the Morrell Way junction, the introduction of a 20mph speed limit with associated traffic calming -– speed tables and speed cushions – the provision of new traffic islands and work to remove existing steps to the library and provide new stepped accesses.

There is also a longer term plan to create an off-road, shared-use pedestrian/cycle route alongside University Road between Green Dykes Lane and Innovation Way.

If the latest proposals are approved in principle by Coun Merrett, the university’s student union and Heslington Parish Council will be consulted.

To view a copy of the report, or to attend the meeting visit democracy.york.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=738&MId=8436

Comments (21)

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8:09am Fri 7 Mar 14

AnotherPointofView says...

It would be useful to be able to go more than zero mph when you have two buses in those bus stops alongside each other.

If moving a bus stop make sure that cars can still get past!

As for the 20mph signs, what a waste of time, just like the rest of York.
It would be useful to be able to go more than zero mph when you have two buses in those bus stops alongside each other. If moving a bus stop make sure that cars can still get past! As for the 20mph signs, what a waste of time, just like the rest of York. AnotherPointofView
  • Score: -40

8:14am Fri 7 Mar 14

Mulgrave says...

Looks like the calmed 20mph zone is back in fashion.......someon
e better break the news to Anna.
Looks like the calmed 20mph zone is back in fashion.......someon e better break the news to Anna. Mulgrave
  • Score: 3

8:28am Fri 7 Mar 14

MrsHoney says...

Great, more speed bumps, just what my car wished for!! The biggest problems along University Road are the bus stops. It's a start moving one of them so they're not directly opposite each other (and therefore makes it very difficult for cars to get past). To me though creating recessed bus stops would be the most sensible idea to get the busses off the road altogether when they're picking up passengers. It's not a case of overly impatient drivers but there are huge numbers getting on the bus so you have to wait ages. I hope the proposed cycle lane allows for traffic both ways. I'm surprised there aren't more people in accidents to be honest it's a very badly designed road and definitely needs tackling but I don't think what they've proposed will really solve the problems, in fact it may well cause more. Particularly in the case of adding more traffic islands, what so nobody can get past bikes at all?! York won't be happy till cars have been banned altogether.
Great, more speed bumps, just what my car wished for!! The biggest problems along University Road are the bus stops. It's a start moving one of them so they're not directly opposite each other (and therefore makes it very difficult for cars to get past). To me though creating recessed bus stops would be the most sensible idea to get the busses off the road altogether when they're picking up passengers. It's not a case of overly impatient drivers but there are huge numbers getting on the bus so you have to wait ages. I hope the proposed cycle lane allows for traffic both ways. I'm surprised there aren't more people in accidents to be honest it's a very badly designed road and definitely needs tackling but I don't think what they've proposed will really solve the problems, in fact it may well cause more. Particularly in the case of adding more traffic islands, what so nobody can get past bikes at all?! York won't be happy till cars have been banned altogether. MrsHoney
  • Score: -38

8:37am Fri 7 Mar 14

Shouter says...

The council won't be happy until ALL cars are banned! The way it is carrying on, if you live in the York area you will not be allowed to own your own car.
The council won't be happy until ALL cars are banned! The way it is carrying on, if you live in the York area you will not be allowed to own your own car. Shouter
  • Score: -41

9:13am Fri 7 Mar 14

fixedfanatic says...

How about they remove the traffic islands that currently prevent vehicles from overtaking cyclists safely, move the town bound bus stop up the road to the layby just a little further up from its current position and relocate the steps from under the library bridge. I cycle this way to work each and have nearly been knocked of my bike on several occasions by motorists, one went round me straight over the traffic island and continued with a flat tyre due to his lack of patience - very pleased they are finally taking a look at this road.
How about they remove the traffic islands that currently prevent vehicles from overtaking cyclists safely, move the town bound bus stop up the road to the layby just a little further up from its current position and relocate the steps from under the library bridge. I cycle this way to work each and have nearly been knocked of my bike on several occasions by motorists, one went round me straight over the traffic island and continued with a flat tyre due to his lack of patience - very pleased they are finally taking a look at this road. fixedfanatic
  • Score: 12

9:28am Fri 7 Mar 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

Why do they insist on putting up these 20mph signs everywhere? have they just buckled into her winging? It makes us as a city look stupid. "oh look honey they have a 20mph sign on a street that is 30meters long... hahaha"

Stop wasting money on a scheme that does not reduce speed and can not be enforced. I actually hope the youths kick them all down. It is disgusting and they are actually making the city look ugly... isn’t there that h&s video where when there are too many signs no one takes notice... that is what is happening...
Why do they insist on putting up these 20mph signs everywhere? have they just buckled into her winging? It makes us as a city look stupid. "oh look honey they have a 20mph sign on a street that is 30meters long... hahaha" Stop wasting money on a scheme that does not reduce speed and can not be enforced. I actually hope the youths kick them all down. It is disgusting and they are actually making the city look ugly... isn’t there that h&s video where when there are too many signs no one takes notice... that is what is happening... Archiebold the 1st
  • Score: -42

9:30am Fri 7 Mar 14

Blartiartfast says...

The council need to take advice from people that actually drive. The islands along with the bus stops cause issues rather than resolve them.
I'm actually up for 20mph zones in the right areas. They might be better respected if the powers that be deployed them in a consistent manner rather than their current policy of sticking different speeds here, there, everywhere, and putting the signs at weird and wonderful heights.
Lastly, it appears that after a chat with a local councilor that the 20mph zones are a huge waste of taxpayers money. The councilor told me quite openly that the police are currently refusing to enforce this particular speed limit.
The council need to take advice from people that actually drive. The islands along with the bus stops cause issues rather than resolve them. I'm actually up for 20mph zones in the right areas. They might be better respected if the powers that be deployed them in a consistent manner rather than their current policy of sticking different speeds here, there, everywhere, and putting the signs at weird and wonderful heights. Lastly, it appears that after a chat with a local councilor that the 20mph zones are a huge waste of taxpayers money. The councilor told me quite openly that the police are currently refusing to enforce this particular speed limit. Blartiartfast
  • Score: -36

9:39am Fri 7 Mar 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

fixedfanatic wrote:
How about they remove the traffic islands that currently prevent vehicles from overtaking cyclists safely, move the town bound bus stop up the road to the layby just a little further up from its current position and relocate the steps from under the library bridge. I cycle this way to work each and have nearly been knocked of my bike on several occasions by motorists, one went round me straight over the traffic island and continued with a flat tyre due to his lack of patience - very pleased they are finally taking a look at this road.
Excellent point! I’ve noticed this in other areas too. There is a cycle path on the road down holgate (i know its my pet hate area) that leads into parked cars without room for the cycle lane to continue. Yet 50m further and there is a traffic island for the oncoming bus route that leaves even less room for cyclists. They will argue that there is a cycle path on the other side of the road but cyclists should be on the road not a path. They don’t think of the safety implications by installing things in stupid areas. What ever happened to safe by design and cdm? who signs these designs off?
[quote][p][bold]fixedfanatic[/bold] wrote: How about they remove the traffic islands that currently prevent vehicles from overtaking cyclists safely, move the town bound bus stop up the road to the layby just a little further up from its current position and relocate the steps from under the library bridge. I cycle this way to work each and have nearly been knocked of my bike on several occasions by motorists, one went round me straight over the traffic island and continued with a flat tyre due to his lack of patience - very pleased they are finally taking a look at this road.[/p][/quote]Excellent point! I’ve noticed this in other areas too. There is a cycle path on the road down holgate (i know its my pet hate area) that leads into parked cars without room for the cycle lane to continue. Yet 50m further and there is a traffic island for the oncoming bus route that leaves even less room for cyclists. They will argue that there is a cycle path on the other side of the road but cyclists should be on the road not a path. They don’t think of the safety implications by installing things in stupid areas. What ever happened to safe by design and cdm? who signs these designs off? Archiebold the 1st
  • Score: -49

9:41am Fri 7 Mar 14

ZachCohen says...

Perhaps educating students on road safety. Especially when they get off the bus and walk across the road with headphones in, with no concern about the tonne of metal coming along the road which I am driving.
Had to check my brakes several times.

1. Move bus stops so they are not directly opposite each other. Try and create recessed bus stops.
2. Get rid of a few pointless island crossings.
3. A dedicated cycle lane is needed and a good idea.
4. Install a pelican crossing for students to cross safely near the bus stops.
Perhaps educating students on road safety. Especially when they get off the bus and walk across the road with headphones in, with no concern about the tonne of metal coming along the road which I am driving. Had to check my brakes several times. 1. Move bus stops so they are not directly opposite each other. Try and create recessed bus stops. 2. Get rid of a few pointless island crossings. 3. A dedicated cycle lane is needed and a good idea. 4. Install a pelican crossing for students to cross safely near the bus stops. ZachCohen
  • Score: 6

9:43am Fri 7 Mar 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

Blartiartfast wrote:
The council need to take advice from people that actually drive. The islands along with the bus stops cause issues rather than resolve them. I'm actually up for 20mph zones in the right areas. They might be better respected if the powers that be deployed them in a consistent manner rather than their current policy of sticking different speeds here, there, everywhere, and putting the signs at weird and wonderful heights. Lastly, it appears that after a chat with a local councilor that the 20mph zones are a huge waste of taxpayers money. The councilor told me quite openly that the police are currently refusing to enforce this particular speed limit.
yep that is 100% correct they can not be enforced at all... The look horrible and they will cause more accidents from people walking into them then slowing down for them.

I actually agree that outside schools and other safety critical areas that 20mph should be enforced. But down every cul de sac on tadcaster road is idiotic. The more 20mph signs people see the less they will abide by the essential ones. Its human nature.
[quote][p][bold]Blartiartfast[/bold] wrote: The council need to take advice from people that actually drive. The islands along with the bus stops cause issues rather than resolve them. I'm actually up for 20mph zones in the right areas. They might be better respected if the powers that be deployed them in a consistent manner rather than their current policy of sticking different speeds here, there, everywhere, and putting the signs at weird and wonderful heights. Lastly, it appears that after a chat with a local councilor that the 20mph zones are a huge waste of taxpayers money. The councilor told me quite openly that the police are currently refusing to enforce this particular speed limit.[/p][/quote]yep that is 100% correct they can not be enforced at all... The look horrible and they will cause more accidents from people walking into them then slowing down for them. I actually agree that outside schools and other safety critical areas that 20mph should be enforced. But down every cul de sac on tadcaster road is idiotic. The more 20mph signs people see the less they will abide by the essential ones. Its human nature. Archiebold the 1st
  • Score: -14

10:44am Fri 7 Mar 14

york_chap says...

Instead of automatically advocating 20mph zones and speed bumps, the council should look at what's actually needed here - (which includes neither of these things).

The bus stops on alternate sides of the road need moving apart, even just by 20 feet so that other traffic can pass when the buses are stopped, which can be for 1 - 3 minutes depending on the time of day. Ideally the bus stops should be recessed to make overtaking easier and safer for drivers and cyclists.

The off-road cycle path should be prioritised as the current road layout is dangerous for cyclists and causes congestion, as vehicles can't safely overtake cyclists on many occasions, due to the narrow carriageway and the number of traffic islands.

The number of traffic islands should be reduced - NOT increased. There is no real need for anyone to cross the road along there anyway, except outside the library, for which purpose a zebra crossing should be created instead of the random traffic islands. At the end of the day there is also a perfectly adequate footbridge right outside the library.

As anyone who uses the route can attest to, the main problems are not caused by vehicles travelling at 30mph. They are caused by the road width being constricted further by traffic islands and bus stops in the carriageway which are located directly opposite each other. As someone else mentioned, students wandering out from behind buses without looking, whilst being distracted by headphones is also an occasional problem. I fail to understand why drivers should be penalised for pedestrians' carelessness and lack of attention by being forced to drive very slowly and over damaging speed bumps.
Instead of automatically advocating 20mph zones and speed bumps, the council should look at what's actually needed here - (which includes neither of these things). The bus stops on alternate sides of the road need moving apart, even just by 20 feet so that other traffic can pass when the buses are stopped, which can be for 1 - 3 minutes depending on the time of day. Ideally the bus stops should be recessed to make overtaking easier and safer for drivers and cyclists. The off-road cycle path should be prioritised as the current road layout is dangerous for cyclists and causes congestion, as vehicles can't safely overtake cyclists on many occasions, due to the narrow carriageway and the number of traffic islands. The number of traffic islands should be reduced - NOT increased. There is no real need for anyone to cross the road along there anyway, except outside the library, for which purpose a zebra crossing should be created instead of the random traffic islands. At the end of the day there is also a perfectly adequate footbridge right outside the library. As anyone who uses the route can attest to, the main problems are not caused by vehicles travelling at 30mph. They are caused by the road width being constricted further by traffic islands and bus stops in the carriageway which are located directly opposite each other. As someone else mentioned, students wandering out from behind buses without looking, whilst being distracted by headphones is also an occasional problem. I fail to understand why drivers should be penalised for pedestrians' carelessness and lack of attention by being forced to drive very slowly and over damaging speed bumps. york_chap
  • Score: -3

12:29pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Mulgrave says...

Congratulations to 20s Plenty - the 20 calmed zone which has been around for donkeys years and doesn't rely on enforcement, and makes a lot of sense if used wisely has been completely undermined. From reading the above posters it is clear many do not see the difference from the entirely seperate agenda of wide area limits with the ludicrous posting of the lower limit on a cul de sac of half a dozen houses and the problems with enforcement .

This zone is basically an admission that 20mph limits alone do not work - unless speeds are already low, in which case why do you need them?
Congratulations to 20s Plenty - the 20 calmed zone which has been around for donkeys years and doesn't rely on enforcement, and makes a lot of sense if used wisely has been completely undermined. From reading the above posters it is clear many do not see the difference from the entirely seperate agenda of wide area limits with the ludicrous posting of the lower limit on a cul de sac of half a dozen houses and the problems with enforcement . This zone is basically an admission that 20mph limits alone do not work - unless speeds are already low, in which case why do you need them? Mulgrave
  • Score: -7

12:42pm Fri 7 Mar 14

rothko says...

I support the scheme in general especially the inclusion of a cycle lane, but unless buses can pull off the road it will not be any safer. Buses are sometimes stopped for several minutes so vehicles have no option but to overtake. This is dangerous as students can end up walking out in front of traffic.
I support the scheme in general especially the inclusion of a cycle lane, but unless buses can pull off the road it will not be any safer. Buses are sometimes stopped for several minutes so vehicles have no option but to overtake. This is dangerous as students can end up walking out in front of traffic. rothko
  • Score: 2

1:00pm Fri 7 Mar 14

MorkofYork says...

"they will cause more accidents from people walking into them then slowing down for them."

loL nice. I don't even support them outside schools. I think drivers can pick the appropriate speed and 20mph is actually too fast when it's busy.
"they will cause more accidents from people walking into them then slowing down for them." loL nice. I don't even support them outside schools. I think drivers can pick the appropriate speed and 20mph is actually too fast when it's busy. MorkofYork
  • Score: -33

1:01pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Buzzz Light-year says...

Yes! Move the bus stops!
Yes! Move the bus stops! Buzzz Light-year
  • Score: -2

1:03pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Buzzz Light-year says...

Oh and while we're about it, can we have rid of the stupid chicanes just round the corner at the start of Heso Lane?
Oh and while we're about it, can we have rid of the stupid chicanes just round the corner at the start of Heso Lane? Buzzz Light-year
  • Score: 15

1:22pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Mulgrave says...

MorkofYork wrote:
"they will cause more accidents from people walking into them then slowing down for them."

loL nice. I don't even support them outside schools. I think drivers can pick the appropriate speed and 20mph is actually too fast when it's busy.
When we only had selected zones the limit of 20mph was taken more as any other limit - a maximum. Where has the idea that 20 is a warm safe user friedly speed come from? In York I think we know better than most.
[quote][p][bold]MorkofYork[/bold] wrote: "they will cause more accidents from people walking into them then slowing down for them." loL nice. I don't even support them outside schools. I think drivers can pick the appropriate speed and 20mph is actually too fast when it's busy.[/p][/quote]When we only had selected zones the limit of 20mph was taken more as any other limit - a maximum. Where has the idea that 20 is a warm safe user friedly speed come from? In York I think we know better than most. Mulgrave
  • Score: -32

5:26pm Fri 7 Mar 14

Meldrew2 says...

Once again more money wasted on stupid 20 mph signs. I agree outside schools (although 20 can be too fast as I found out on Monday when a little girl fell off her scooter on St Helens Bridge. At 20 I would probably have hit her!).

I get the feeling someone has mis-painted a bucket load of signs and Del Boy has made our council an offer they can't refuse. Lubly jubly!

I also guess they will be removed from the TDF route so that the cyclists don't have to slow down for them?
Once again more money wasted on stupid 20 mph signs. I agree outside schools (although 20 can be too fast as I found out on Monday when a little girl fell off her scooter on St Helens Bridge. At 20 I would probably have hit her!). I get the feeling someone has mis-painted a bucket load of signs and Del Boy has made our council an offer they can't refuse. Lubly jubly! I also guess they will be removed from the TDF route so that the cyclists don't have to slow down for them? Meldrew2
  • Score: -36

9:45pm Fri 7 Mar 14

MorkofYork says...

There's no need for the limit off peak hours. If we can be trusted to decide what's safe between 0-20 we can decide when it's safe to do 30 and below.

I used to think they were a PR thing, to make it look like the council were acting locally. Mention kids and people will accept it without really thinking if it's needed or actually serving any use at all.

20's plenty take it to a mind numbingly stupid level. putting '20' signs on cul-de-sacs and twisty roads.
Now people realize what Anna's doing suddenly she doesn't want anymore consultations.

You wonder how she was ever let into the party until you realize they are all as bad as each other.
There's no need for the limit off peak hours. If we can be trusted to decide what's safe between 0-20 we can decide when it's safe to do 30 and below. I used to think they were a PR thing, to make it look like the council were acting locally. Mention kids and people will accept it without really thinking if it's needed or actually serving any use at all. 20's plenty take it to a mind numbingly stupid level. putting '20' signs on cul-de-sacs and twisty roads. Now people realize what Anna's doing suddenly she doesn't want anymore consultations. You wonder how she was ever let into the party until you realize they are all as bad as each other. MorkofYork
  • Score: -32

1:52am Sat 8 Mar 14

strangebuttrue? says...

It still surprise me that some think that the council do not know what they are doing when it comes up with road schemes that seem stupid to most and appear to create congestion, conflict and danger. They are busy taking out bus recesses, lately on the A59, and trying to make sure nothing can get past a bus which has stopped. It seems to me that they will stop at nothing to rid the city of cars.

An AA test showed that if you put speed humps in a 30mph zone it increases fuel consumption by about 47% and I believe that along with he added fuel consumption of a vehicle travelling at 20mph with speed humps this will be worse and result in a corresponding increase in pollution. We then have Mr Merrett telling us pollution is killing us in far greater numbers than accidents involving vehicles.????

It is unfortunate that a small minority of drivers do travel at idiotic speeds if left unfettered and because of this we all have to put up with some sort of physical management of speeds in certain areas but what this council does goes way beyond this.
It still surprise me that some think that the council do not know what they are doing when it comes up with road schemes that seem stupid to most and appear to create congestion, conflict and danger. They are busy taking out bus recesses, lately on the A59, and trying to make sure nothing can get past a bus which has stopped. It seems to me that they will stop at nothing to rid the city of cars. An AA test showed that if you put speed humps in a 30mph zone it increases fuel consumption by about 47% and I believe that along with he added fuel consumption of a vehicle travelling at 20mph with speed humps this will be worse and result in a corresponding increase in pollution. We then have Mr Merrett telling us pollution is killing us in far greater numbers than accidents involving vehicles.???? It is unfortunate that a small minority of drivers do travel at idiotic speeds if left unfettered and because of this we all have to put up with some sort of physical management of speeds in certain areas but what this council does goes way beyond this. strangebuttrue?
  • Score: -29

3:57am Sat 8 Mar 14

Magicman! says...

fixedfanatic wrote:
How about they remove the traffic islands that currently prevent vehicles from overtaking cyclists safely, move the town bound bus stop up the road to the layby just a little further up from its current position and relocate the steps from under the library bridge. I cycle this way to work each and have nearly been knocked of my bike on several occasions by motorists, one went round me straight over the traffic island and continued with a flat tyre due to his lack of patience - very pleased they are finally taking a look at this road.
Indeed... the traffic islands placed so frequently are pointless - as a cyclist, I can practically feel motorists breathing down my neck as I'm going uphill and they can't get past due to the traffic islands... and then you get those who overtake about 2 meters from a traffic island and cut in dangerously close. Generally though a good number of drivers are considerate along the road, but there are some who make it difficult for the rest, because their poor driving pretty much forces the hand of the council to put in traffic calming methods.

As for the off-road shared use cycle/pedestrian route - why is that 'long term'? if it was done first and put on the south side of the road aimed for the cyclists going uphill, it woud give a safe area for those cyclists and vehicle drivers would have the carriageway to themselves going uphill, and then the traffic islands wouldn't affect traffic in that direction....
... also, will the shared use be properly delineated with a slight change in surface levels between pedestrian side and cycle side, with regular signs both beside and on the route to show which side is for whom? OK, regular signage doesn't work on the route along Heslington Field Lane, as people wallk all over that and yet if you look up what the sign actually means (bicycle in blue circle, without any pedestrians on the pictogram), the route is designed for cycles only and technically is not a footpath at all - but at least if you're going along and somebody is in the way you can then point to the sign saying as such.
[quote][p][bold]fixedfanatic[/bold] wrote: How about they remove the traffic islands that currently prevent vehicles from overtaking cyclists safely, move the town bound bus stop up the road to the layby just a little further up from its current position and relocate the steps from under the library bridge. I cycle this way to work each and have nearly been knocked of my bike on several occasions by motorists, one went round me straight over the traffic island and continued with a flat tyre due to his lack of patience - very pleased they are finally taking a look at this road.[/p][/quote]Indeed... the traffic islands placed so frequently are pointless - as a cyclist, I can practically feel motorists breathing down my neck as I'm going uphill and they can't get past due to the traffic islands... and then you get those who overtake about 2 meters from a traffic island and cut in dangerously close. Generally though a good number of drivers are considerate along the road, but there are some who make it difficult for the rest, because their poor driving pretty much forces the hand of the council to put in traffic calming methods. As for the off-road shared use cycle/pedestrian route - why is that 'long term'? if it was done first and put on the south side of the road aimed for the cyclists going uphill, it woud give a safe area for those cyclists and vehicle drivers would have the carriageway to themselves going uphill, and then the traffic islands wouldn't affect traffic in that direction.... ... also, will the shared use be properly delineated with a slight change in surface levels between pedestrian side and cycle side, with regular signs both beside and on the route to show which side is for whom? OK, regular signage doesn't work on the route along Heslington Field Lane, as people wallk all over that and yet if you look up what the sign actually means (bicycle in blue circle, without any pedestrians on the pictogram), the route is designed for cycles only and technically is not a footpath at all - but at least if you're going along and somebody is in the way you can then point to the sign saying as such. Magicman!
  • Score: -2

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