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Bus firm scraps free service for students (From York Press)
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First scraps free bus service for students at University of York
9:06am Tuesday 25th September 2012 in News
By Mike Laycock, Chief reporter
YORK’S biggest bus operator has come under fire after scrapping a free bus service between the University of York ’s old and new campuses.
Students’ union president Kallum Taylor branded the decision by First a “double slap in the face” for students.
He claimed that as well as scrapping the service to Heslington East without any consultation with the union or university, First was also putting spare resources into the route between Heslington West – the old campus – and the city centre.
He claimed this could take custom away from a rival service, UniBus, and erode the wider extra services and deals it offered to students which included, buses during moving-in days and a “Clubbers’ Bus” which got students back to campus safely after nights out without causing noise nuisance to residents en route. He said he would encourage all students to support UniBus wherever possible and avoid using First buses.
But a spokesman for First hit back, saying that unlike another bus operator running to the university, First did not receive a financial subsidy from the university to provide free travel for students to Heslington East.
“Also we do not have access to the private road that runs into the Heslington East campus, so currently have to run on Field Lane which at times is very congested, which impacts on our reliability,” he said.
“Therefore, as the only operator running a fully commercial service, we have to make commercially-based decisions on how we can provide a bus service to this area.
"However we are happy to engage with students, who are extremely important to us as our customers on service 4, and we are happy to meet with the Students’ Union on their behalf.”
He said the number 4 service would now run up to the science park and then down on to Field Lane before returning to Heslington Hall.
“We have also introduced a new service 14 that serves the university sports village. More details are on our website.”
Comments(59)
amike
says...
9:24am Tue 25 Sep 12
First speak for if you would like to give us some money then we'll do business with you if not then we'll do our best to squeeze out your subsidised services so we can replace them with nothing.
roskoboskovic
says...
9:34am Tue 25 Sep 12
BL2
says...
9:36am Tue 25 Sep 12
Acomblady
says...
9:52am Tue 25 Sep 12
Ignatius Lumpopo
says...
9:54am Tue 25 Sep 12
Oaklands Resident
says...
10:11am Tue 25 Sep 12
The media have let York residents down by not fully publicising the major changes to bus services that First are introducing on 7th October.
Lack of information is leading to misunderstandings. Acomblady is right, to a point, about the number 4. However at Foxwood shops it will become a number 5 and continue to Cornlands Road, Acomb shops, Danebury Drive and beyond in a big loop (eventually linking to Huntington and Strensal).
I agree with her, though, about the ftr and the withdrawal by First of conductors (hosts). Big mistake.
Omega Point
says...
10:20am Tue 25 Sep 12
smudge1 wrote:The people it affects, what a stupid comment
Anybody interested ??
YorkPatrol
says...
10:26am Tue 25 Sep 12
And before all the students start moaning.... just cut down on the booze, parties and silly clothes
asd
says...
10:35am Tue 25 Sep 12
YorkPatrol wrote:Not sterotyping at all are we. First York is a pathetic profit driven company which the council has no backbone to critisis or terminate their contract and offer to maybe a rival company. First York has over inflated buses prices compared with there other operations like Leeds for example. Also we had to get rid of conductors because the FTR is scrapped, what alot of B*ll*cks, so conductors cant manouver on a double decker? they used to do. It is simple cost cutting,profitering and trying to shift blame to everyone else!
Why on earth should Students get a FREE bus service anyway.. And before all the students start moaning.... just cut down on the booze, parties and silly clothes
xtc
says...
11:56am Tue 25 Sep 12
lowbeam
says...
11:57am Tue 25 Sep 12
Kevin Tennent
says...
12:08pm Tue 25 Sep 12
It isn't always convenient to walk from Heslington Hall, especially on a day like today. If I am to continue to get a bus to Heslington East from my home I will have to buy a First monthly pass and a Unibus pass, at almost double the expense, or an all York ticket which is 20% more expensive than a First weekly pass.
Meanwhile I and other members of staff will be forced to use our cars, and First will loose about £400 a year of my custom.
chickpea
says...
1:35pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Ignatius Lumpopo
says...
1:38pm Tue 25 Sep 12
meme
says...
1:42pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Plus the University and CoYC should have thought about the transport issues when they designed the car free campus with parking miles from the buildings which no one wants to use.
If the Uni wants a free bus service they should provide one NOT First who are in business to make a profit not molycoddle students who leech of us all anyway with no rates/subsidised grants/ 3 years partying to come out with a degree in costume design for Afghanistani ballroom dancing theatre. Not much chance of benefitting society with that is there?
Everone is entitled to an education but oine that is practical and does not cost us all a fortune which we dont have anymore..Actually we never had a fortune but Gordon Frown and Ed Falls tried to make us think we had and like mother Hubbard emptied our cupboard and now its bare and we are all going to pay for it whether we like it or not.
Happy Chappie
says...
1:56pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Kevin Tennent
says...
2:05pm Tue 25 Sep 12
As it is, the big issue here is not that free journeys are ending but that the bus will no longer serve the Heslington East campus.
yorkie71
says...
2:19pm Tue 25 Sep 12
gerry1962
says...
2:30pm Tue 25 Sep 12
York1900
says...
2:54pm Tue 25 Sep 12
This most be a plan for First to sell us the all services £5.00 ticket
First chop routes to grab a new route
It is time that the other bus companies in York started running full services on all routes in York so First had to compete
First have done nothing for York all they have done is pushed other bus operators out so they can control bus services in York and hold the City Council and bus using public to ransom over services
atorycouncil2014
says...
2:56pm Tue 25 Sep 12
old_geezer
says...
2:59pm Tue 25 Sep 12
(I'd like buses run by a PTE, but sadly no chance)
Magoose
says...
3:06pm Tue 25 Sep 12
benmac89
says...
3:12pm Tue 25 Sep 12
its also essential for people trying to keep to strict schedules between campuses. With 5 minutes between lectures and meetings a bus service is important.
not to mention that it is crucial for any student with certain disabilities or mobility issues.
its a £2 return otherwise, which is expensive on a day to day basis. but you know what? NOT ALL STUDENTS DRINK! We work hard, play hard, and some happen to drink hard too. We all budget stringently.
don't perpetuate such a stupid stereotype. students are now paying £9000 a year, plus accommodation and living costs. free services like busses are a perk that can well be afforded.
First have shot themselves in the foot by not consulting with Kallum and the SU, more power to the uni bus.
Natasha Anson
says...
3:47pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Dave Taylor
says...
4:21pm Tue 25 Sep 12
And, yes, I rather liked Ignatius' little joke too. :)
Magoose
says...
5:12pm Tue 25 Sep 12
GuyWithCommonSense
says...
5:22pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Also I think it's unfair for everyone on here to be commenting from students perspectives as relatively few students actually read the local press and (no offence) the majority of comments on here are coming from a very different generation...
AnotherPointofView
says...
6:16pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Ignatius Lumpopo wrote:As a commercial company First are quite to withdraw this "free" service.
I thought my joke about University of York students no getting a First was quite a good one...
Why did they introduce it in the first place?
lowbeam
says...
6:36pm Tue 25 Sep 12
I do,and most nights all we hear are drunken arguments,swearing..
and in the morning we see the vomit and broken bottles..
the girls are the worst and i live in a residential street..where there are children..
So..Never mind the buses,get these students..just to have two or three drinks less on a night time,they are after all going to be our future leaders are they not?
was york now rotherham
says...
7:10pm Tue 25 Sep 12
amike
says...
7:16pm Tue 25 Sep 12
AnotherPointofView wrote:To try and take trade away from the 44 of course - like the £2 fare from York to the uni which is subsidised by all the other fare paying public in York to do the same.
Ignatius Lumpopo wrote:As a commercial company First are quite to withdraw this "free" service.
I thought my joke about University of York students no getting a First was quite a good one...
Why did they introduce it in the first place?
daveyboy25
says...
8:45pm Tue 25 Sep 12
Kevin Tennent wrote:not the case the uni bus is free campus to campus all you will need is a ticket on the 4
This is not just an issue for students but university staff as well, because Heslington East is being cut off from the rest of York's bus system. I work in the Management School at Heslington East and commute from Acomb, so the shortening of the 4's route will directly affect me.
It isn't always convenient to walk from Heslington Hall, especially on a day like today. If I am to continue to get a bus to Heslington East from my home I will have to buy a First monthly pass and a Unibus pass, at almost double the expense, or an all York ticket which is 20% more expensive than a First weekly pass.
Meanwhile I and other members of staff will be forced to use our cars, and First will loose about £400 a year of my custom.
Yorklass2008
says...
8:49pm Tue 25 Sep 12
First still has drivers wages, fuel costs, vehicle maintenance and everything else that goes into running a vehicle of this size, but some residents of York clearly have no comprehension of this
daveyboy25
says...
8:58pm Tue 25 Sep 12
daveyboy25
says...
9:01pm Tue 25 Sep 12
gerry1962 wrote:well park as hes east youve got a car dont really see where you have an issue. its nice youve got that choice, plus you will probably be allowed to park in the building
I also work at the University and sometimes take the No4 from Acomb into work. Sometimes I drive and park at the Info Centre on campus and then take the bus to Hes East - it was good that I had a choice between 4 and 44. I am in a wheelchair - at the other end coming back to Hes West, I have had to wait for FOUR 44's sometimes before one is accessible - I hope they are going to take these buses away (or one or two of them) to make them more accessible. So yes, it is of interest to me, smudge1 - you idiot.
Caliyorkia
says...
5:39am Wed 26 Sep 12
Ignatius Lumpopo wrote:I liked your joke Ignatius! Very clever.
The comments from the president of the students' union imply that no-one at York University will be getting a First for the foreseeable future...
steve_york
says...
10:22am Wed 26 Sep 12
Theapplesarecoming
says...
10:48am Wed 26 Sep 12
The idea of a degree is that you have to spend money on the course and spend a few years living on a low amount of money a learning and when you Finish your degree you then earn a higher wage than most people once you get a job
It's a trade off
Such as spending all your money on cars and booze when your young means you will have less to pay your house off with and/ or enjoy your retirement as an older person
I don't booze or spend money on much luxuries , i am living a quiet life now in my 20s so that I can enjoy my life if the future
Everyone has to make trade offs in life
Leaving school for uni probably cos you do not know what job you want (or can't get one) then boozing sleeping around spending money on (silly clothes as someone put it) then expecting to get services free and then a high payed job in life is wanting it both ways and it's not realistic
The student protests over fee rises were richly don't over certain things like nick pleb lying to thenm , however things cost what they cost and us taxpayers can't subsidise your life at uni and your life after uni like how we pay part of your pensions for your high payed jobs
Loosing a bus service that was free is not something you have a right to moan about what you get so much else given to you
Kevin Tennent
says...
10:51am Wed 26 Sep 12
daveyboy25 wrote:So you want me to get the 4 to Hes West and then change? I could easily loose 20 minutes doing that. I already get the 1 into town from Front Street before changing to the 4 as its quicker and I can jump two '4's ahead.
Kevin Tennent wrote:not the case the uni bus is free campus to campus all you will need is a ticket on the 4
This is not just an issue for students but university staff as well, because Heslington East is being cut off from the rest of York's bus system. I work in the Management School at Heslington East and commute from Acomb, so the shortening of the 4's route will directly affect me.
It isn't always convenient to walk from Heslington Hall, especially on a day like today. If I am to continue to get a bus to Heslington East from my home I will have to buy a First monthly pass and a Unibus pass, at almost double the expense, or an all York ticket which is 20% more expensive than a First weekly pass.
Meanwhile I and other members of staff will be forced to use our cars, and First will loose about £400 a year of my custom.
It's correct that the big issue here is not free bus travel for students (on a very short route) but the loss of the 4 to the Hes East site which represents a major investment by the university in its future. We are just about to open up a new college there with over 600 students. It's not just about students either. We provide incubation facilities for start up businesses and there is also a TV studio on the site which wins competitive TV/film work. It's important for the success of the site that it is linked into York's wider transport network. As it is we will end up with an expensive bus interchange served only by the UB1 and the occasional TransDev bus - what a joke.
As for First's assertion that there is traffic congestion on Field Lane, I can see it from my office, and I have never seen standing traffic there.
Theapplesarecoming
says...
11:00am Wed 26 Sep 12
mjr119
says...
11:15am Wed 26 Sep 12
The University of York has expanded its campus so that it is not practicable in some circumstances to get from one area of the campus to another within, say, 10 minutes on foot.
The students that stay on campus or live in the city, don't have a say in where their tutorials or lectures take place.
The University provides vast amounts of business to First in its staff and students paying for its services throughout the city. The University's growth is of great benefit to First. Therefore it makes sense to leverage this power to say to First "look, we put a huge amount of business your way, we've got a problem in getting people between the two campus' - you can help us out".
As far as I can see this is a logical and sensible arrangement. You scratch my back, I'll scratch yours.
I think what First are doing is called having your cake and eating it. And that doesn't work.
RMcIntosh
says...
2:22pm Wed 26 Sep 12
A further point is that First is a PRIVATE company, like the train services, despite being a PUBLIC service, maybe if our bus and train services were made a publicly owned enterprise like in Europe our trains and busses would run more on time, be nicer, and we would have more say in where when and how they run, aswell as how much it costs us, rather than it being for the profit of a few shareholders who don't care about students or the general public for that matter.
kirchheim
says...
3:07pm Wed 26 Sep 12
thepicer
says...
3:15pm Wed 26 Sep 12
Students are not moaning about the loss of a free bus service, we do not care we have the 44 which is subsidised by the University, whom we take out loans and pay £9000 a year, so no one is getting anything for 'free' at all actually, so comments made about us being spoilt or in a similar vein I find rather superfluous, if any of you read the article first is going out of its way to increase its buses along the uni route to compete with Unibus (44) potentially reducing the profitability of the Unibus, despite the subsidy. The fact is First are rattled by the competition from Unibus particularly since Transdev (a huge multinational like first) took over Unibus from York Pullman.
To the troll (meme) who talked of n 'costume design for Afghanistani ballroom dancing theatre' no the university out of the hundreds of courses offered only runs ONE 'micky-mouse degree' course; theatre, film, and television studies. I guess the other rigorous courses the University offers slipped you by, I mean you have any idea how many engineering graduates go from York to work for BAE, Thales or Phillips Medical devices, York is not a Polytechnic.
You locals come across a little slow.
Bigsharn
says...
3:25pm Wed 26 Sep 12
Firstbus only started running to Hes East because the Unibus did the same. From what I remember hearing at the time, First WAS approached about running a service to Hes East but deemed it financially unviable and turned it down.
And as regards to the hosts, let's remember the only reason they were introduced in the first place, was because the FTR ticket machines were incredibly unreliable.
Dennis.Dart
says...
3:34pm Wed 26 Sep 12
chickpea wrote:if the uni had to run a 'bus service' it would need a operators licence drivers with a class D licence and be subject to EU driving laws, not so simple now is it
i used to work in Heslington and cycled 40 mins each way every day, whatever the weather. If I went clubbing as a youngster I got a taxi home. We didn't have free buses. If I coudn't afford the fare I would walk home. Seems like most people are allergic to walking these days. I'm sure York Uni could afford to run it's own bus service if needed. Failing that, it's hardly a long walk from the campus to Fulford Road or to Tang Hall to catch one of the frequent buses which run from there.
Digeorge
says...
3:55pm Wed 26 Sep 12
First off, a thing about student loans, nobody pays anything until they are earning £21,000, it is the Government that pays. Nobody has paid anything but the Government through Student Finance England. I have a student loan for a three/four year course and know what the rules are.
But what I would point out is that both Leeds and surrounding areas of West Yorkshire have cheap travel for students, the hop a long bus in Leeds for 0.50p is cheap as is £72.90 for a monthly student metro card covering zone 5 and free bus travel in Huddersfield. All subsidised travel by First Leeds including those looking for a job. There is no such service in York and a return journey in York is £3.50 to go up the road, £3.70 Day Rover. It is hugely expensive but 44s mean that there are fewer no 4 buses going around the city.
mjr119
says...
4:41pm Wed 26 Sep 12
thepicer wrote:Oh dear.
the comments made by some of you are a)rude b) show you need to have a comprehension class
Students are not moaning about the loss of a free bus service, we do not care we have the 44 which is subsidised by the University, whom we take out loans and pay £9000 a year, so no one is getting anything for 'free' at all actually, so comments made about us being spoilt or in a similar vein I find rather superfluous, if any of you read the article first is going out of its way to increase its buses along the uni route to compete with Unibus (44) potentially reducing the profitability of the Unibus, despite the subsidy. The fact is First are rattled by the competition from Unibus particularly since Transdev (a huge multinational like first) took over Unibus from York Pullman.
To the troll (meme) who talked of n 'costume design for Afghanistani ballroom dancing theatre' no the university out of the hundreds of courses offered only runs ONE 'micky-mouse degree' course; theatre, film, and television studies. I guess the other rigorous courses the University offers slipped you by, I mean you have any idea how many engineering graduates go from York to work for BAE, Thales or Phillips Medical devices, York is not a Polytechnic.
You locals come across a little slow.
If the comments on this article offer generalisations about 'drunk and rowdy' students, you've certainly managed to fairly represent the 'pompous and snobby' ones.
I'm local, but I also went to York University many years ago, received a very good degree which although not Mickey Mouse, was certainly essentially worthless!
Illegal Interrupt
says...
9:27pm Wed 26 Sep 12
helsha10
says...
11:15pm Wed 26 Sep 12
roskoboskovic wrote:I am not arguing that students should be entitled to a free bus service, I also agree that students are able to walk that distance. However uneducated comments like this wind me up, my student loan does not even cover my rent this therefore leaves me with no 'disposable income.' I presume from your job you have money to pay for a home, food, transport etc. I on the other cannot afford my rent without getting a job. I think you shall find students are not well off and are infact 'cash strapped.' In this case a free bus service would help the students, although you'd expect the university to subsidise it in some way, First should not be expected to provide a free service.
considering that most of these students have more disposable income than poorly paid and unemployed york kids thanks to low rate loans i suspect that they can afford to pay for a bus ride.in todays cash strapped climate there s no place for freebies.
gmsgop
says...
12:32am Thu 27 Sep 12
RMcIntosh wrote:OK, so you have done exactly what you have accused the correspondents on this post- you have tarred York folks with a negative attitude to students. You are just as guilty as these partial correspondents!
Is it just me or are some people using this as an excuse just to rant about students and the 'youth of today'? I'm starting at York uni this october and the attitude of the town towards the students is putting me off wanting to come to York, which I think is a shame. There have been several complaints about students living off of the countrys taxes etc, but my students loan doesn't even cover my accomodation costs let alone food! I'm having to get a job and have help from my parents, and though I'm not having to travel from campus to campus I am having to travel into town to Kings manor for my lectures, and this was my choice, but for students whose choice wasn't to be on a different campus to their course but have ended up like that shouldn't be persecuted! I'm sure they'd rather pay their own way if they could, and which we all will when we have jobs and pay taxes - and York is any extremely respectable and traditional university - but if they are in the same situation as me that may be very difficult! I'm not denying that I like to go out, because I do very much, but why should you tar all students with the same brush when actually its only the minority that cause a nuisance of themselves.
A further point is that First is a PRIVATE company, like the train services, despite being a PUBLIC service, maybe if our bus and train services were made a publicly owned enterprise like in Europe our trains and busses would run more on time, be nicer, and we would have more say in where when and how they run, aswell as how much it costs us, rather than it being for the profit of a few shareholders who don't care about students or the general public for that matter.
You need to understand that most people welcome the students but there are very many thousands- a proportion of those really cause problems for the community- which results in the negative occurrences stated above.
If students realised that the something like £3.3 millions have to be found to cover student council tax alone- perhaps there would be at least an appreciation of the views of the ratepayers seen here.
Students do cost us money, various noise and other social nuisances- its an issue - it has to be faced. But saying you don't like the attitude of the city, on the basis of twenty or so commentators... Looks naive- and thoughtless, and not good for human resource folks looking for online activity to access potential job applicant's suitability.
ASP
says...
4:20am Thu 27 Sep 12
ASP
says...
4:28am Thu 27 Sep 12
Natasha Anson wrote:at my nephews school they have a walking bus. All you need is a high viz vest to board it. you students are good at organising, get it done. Plus think of the benefits from the exercise and fresh air. Win Win situation init.........
I'm a first year student on the Heslington East campus, with lectures on Hes West. Some dont finish until 7 or 8pm, meaning in the winter I'll be travelling back in the dark. Would people here want their 18 year old daughter walking 15 minutes in the dark? Not all students are the same...
daveyboy25
says...
6:49pm Thu 27 Sep 12
Kevin Tennent wrote:which way does your window face since the begining of last week its been a nightmare down field lane
daveyboy25 wrote:So you want me to get the 4 to Hes West and then change? I could easily loose 20 minutes doing that. I already get the 1 into town from Front Street before changing to the 4 as its quicker and I can jump two '4's ahead.
Kevin Tennent wrote:not the case the uni bus is free campus to campus all you will need is a ticket on the 4
This is not just an issue for students but university staff as well, because Heslington East is being cut off from the rest of York's bus system. I work in the Management School at Heslington East and commute from Acomb, so the shortening of the 4's route will directly affect me.
It isn't always convenient to walk from Heslington Hall, especially on a day like today. If I am to continue to get a bus to Heslington East from my home I will have to buy a First monthly pass and a Unibus pass, at almost double the expense, or an all York ticket which is 20% more expensive than a First weekly pass.
Meanwhile I and other members of staff will be forced to use our cars, and First will loose about £400 a year of my custom.
It's correct that the big issue here is not free bus travel for students (on a very short route) but the loss of the 4 to the Hes East site which represents a major investment by the university in its future. We are just about to open up a new college there with over 600 students. It's not just about students either. We provide incubation facilities for start up businesses and there is also a TV studio on the site which wins competitive TV/film work. It's important for the success of the site that it is linked into York's wider transport network. As it is we will end up with an expensive bus interchange served only by the UB1 and the occasional TransDev bus - what a joke.
As for First's assertion that there is traffic congestion on Field Lane, I can see it from my office, and I have never seen standing traffic there.
daveyboy25
says...
6:53pm Thu 27 Sep 12
mjr119
says...
10:06am Fri 28 Sep 12
daveyboy25 wrote:Yes - I'll work for free, if the same people that I work for free for, then provide me with millions of pounds in business the rest of the time.
Campus still has a free bus, one that is paid for by the uni for the uni, its called transdev n.o 44. why doesnt the uni share the contract as transdev will not be able to cope alone with the shear amount of students. first have done the right thing, their not getting paid, their not doing the job. anyone on here want to work for free
It makes sense.
Stevie D
says...
8:51pm Fri 28 Sep 12
gerry1962 wrote:
I am in a wheelchair - at the other end coming back to Hes West, I have had to wait for FOUR 44's sometimes before one is accessible - I hope they are going to take these buses away (or one or two of them) to make them more accessible.
That is unfortunate. Transdev now have four wheelchair-accessibl
e buses used for Unibus, and I believe there are more on the way before Christmas.
Kevin Tennent wrote:
As it is we will end up with an expensive bus interchange served only by the UB1 and the occasional TransDev bus - what a joke.
"Occasional"? The Unibus 44 runs every 10 minutes, the same as First have been doing.
mjr119 wrote:
The University provides vast amounts of business to First in its staff and students paying for its services throughout the city. The University's growth is of great benefit to First. Therefore it makes sense to leverage this power to say to First "look, we put a huge amount of business your way, we've got a problem in getting people between the two campus' - you can help us out."
They tried that 3 years ago and First weren't interested. Since then, they have been promoting links with Pullman/Transdev instead, and First are now possibly paying the price for their initial reluctance to engage.
smudge1 says...
9:12am Tue 25 Sep 12