New row over York "spy van" as data shows most fines are far from schools

York Press: The van being launched in February - but most fines are well away from the school run The van being launched in February - but most fines are well away from the school run

YORK'S controversial "spy van" has issued hundreds of fines to drivers on city centre sidestreets and rural roads, far from the school drop-off areas it was introduced to patrol.

The CCTV safety van has been operating in York since March, and new figures obtained under the Freedom of Information Act reveal the streets where drivers have most often been fined.

In its first seven weeks, 473 penalty charge notices (PCNs) were issued. Almost half of those fines - 222- remain unpaid and 65 drivers have appealed their fines.

The data shows that most fines have been issued in a handful streets far from school gate problem zones, leading to accusations that the car is being cynically used to bring in revenue for the council.

On one street alone, Garden Place off Stonebow, 148 fines have been issued, including 14 in a single day.

The van has visited the same stretch of road on 24 out of the 33 days it has operated.

The use of the van has angered drivers such as Michael Amesbury, who was fined twice on Garden Place in two days, and it has drawn criticism from political opponents.

Conservative leader Cllr Chris Steward said: "Disappointingly it seems the camera car is being used to raise revenue rather than safety. When residents were told about the car it was supposed to improve safety around schools and many would welcome that use; it will knock confidence to see it being used so often nowhere near schools.

"Cynics will think the camera car’s fines are a replacement for the lack of Lendal Bridge fines so that Labour can still fund its vanity projects!"

Mr Amesbury said he and his wife pulled over in the side street while one visited the bank nearby, but now the couple say they avoid the city centre as the risk of being fined.

When the council launched the CCTV van it said it was to focus on irresponsible parking outside schools, but the four most-commonly fined streets were Garden Place, Walmgate, Clifford Street and Murton Lane, none of which is on a busy school run. Between them those streets generated 259 PCNs. Of the top 10, only three - Minster Yard, Blossom Street and Acomb road - have schools nearby.

The council has previously argued that using the camera car only during school drop-off and pick-up hours would be a waste of its resources, and said the camera car has the support of police and headteachers.

Now senior officials have defended the council's position, saying the original arguments still apply.

Sally Burns, council director of communities and neighbourhoods, said: “The Road Safety Camera Car was introduced following calls from head teachers over concerns of illegally and potentially dangerous parking in and around schools and is also supported by North Yorkshire Police. As is normal practice nationally, the camera car is deployed to cover other ‘no waiting / stopping restrictions areas’.

"The camera car is not used to discourage driving or to drive away customers from businesses in the targeted areas, but to enforce legal and safe parking. If drivers adhere to these restrictions they will not risk being fined."

 

TOP TEN STREETS FOR FINES IN MARCH AND APRIL

1 - Garden Place - 148

2 - Walmgate - 48

3 - Clifford Street - 38

4 - Murton Lane - 25

5 - Monks Cross Link Road - 24

6= - The Stonebow - 18

6= - Minster Yard - 18

8 - Blossom Street - 17

9 - Acomb Road - 16

10 - Pavement - 15

Comments (40)

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6:47pm Tue 3 Jun 14

Thecynic says...

Anyone who receives a ticket, (be it from the van or a warden) for parking illegally really hasn't got much of a leg to stand on when complaining. However, most of us know that there has been a massive amount of cars creating a safety issue around the schools of York, therefore it is disappointing to say the least, that (according to the released figures) there doesn't appear to be as much effort taken to try and rectify the problemsaround the schools first, before moving onto other streets.
Either the vast majority of these parents on the school run have become 'safety concious' overnight? or, the vehicle isn't spending as much time and effort in safeguarding the areas (and children) that it was intended for in the first place.
Anyone who receives a ticket, (be it from the van or a warden) for parking illegally really hasn't got much of a leg to stand on when complaining. However, most of us know that there has been a massive amount of cars creating a safety issue around the schools of York, therefore it is disappointing to say the least, that (according to the released figures) there doesn't appear to be as much effort taken to try and rectify the problemsaround the schools first, before moving onto other streets. Either the vast majority of these parents on the school run have become 'safety concious' overnight? or, the vehicle isn't spending as much time and effort in safeguarding the areas (and children) that it was intended for in the first place. Thecynic
  • Score: 25

7:28pm Tue 3 Jun 14

jay, york says...

Yet again we see the lies and deception from this labour council. They need a new source of revenue to increase their funds after the Lendal Bridge Fiasco - and although it is early days, this appears to be the latest one.
One would have thought that with all the publicity for safety outside schools when this spy car was first introduced, that would be the main core of its work. But it appears not to be the case. Is there any wonder that nobody believes a flipping word that this labour couincil say! It is all lies, lies and more ,lies. The sooner they go, the better!.
Yet again we see the lies and deception from this labour council. They need a new source of revenue to increase their funds after the Lendal Bridge Fiasco - and although it is early days, this appears to be the latest one. One would have thought that with all the publicity for safety outside schools when this spy car was first introduced, that would be the main core of its work. But it appears not to be the case. Is there any wonder that nobody believes a flipping word that this labour couincil say! It is all lies, lies and more ,lies. The sooner they go, the better!. jay, york
  • Score: -41

7:38pm Tue 3 Jun 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

The war against the motorist continues, only now Labour have openly added lies and contempt to their arsenal of anti car weapons.

Well done Jay -76 in 8 minutes.
The war against the motorist continues, only now Labour have openly added lies and contempt to their arsenal of anti car weapons. Well done Jay -76 in 8 minutes. YOUWILLDOASISAY
  • Score: -23

7:47pm Tue 3 Jun 14

Older Sometimes Wiser says...

When the Local Council "take over " Policing duties this "mindless behavior" happens.The TV camera and its operatives are "automatons" ,unable to make value judgments ( eg on stopping to post a letter or drop off a parcel etc at Age UK ) Hence the decision ie guilty of an offense is made automatically. This how Council Officers tend to behave and they are supported by the ruling elite, the Cabinet!
They rule, we comply, and there are no doubt more examples to follow !
If I am wrong let them tell us...............
When the Local Council "take over " Policing duties this "mindless behavior" happens.The TV camera and its operatives are "automatons" ,unable to make value judgments ( eg on stopping to post a letter or drop off a parcel etc at Age UK ) Hence the decision ie guilty of an offense is made automatically. This how Council Officers tend to behave and they are supported by the ruling elite, the Cabinet! They rule, we comply, and there are no doubt more examples to follow ! If I am wrong let them tell us............... Older Sometimes Wiser
  • Score: -16

7:50pm Tue 3 Jun 14

andy fowler says...

They have lost their Lendal Bridge revenue so this is their pathetic attempt to recoup.

Watch for -200 in 20 seconds
They have lost their Lendal Bridge revenue so this is their pathetic attempt to recoup. Watch for -200 in 20 seconds andy fowler
  • Score: -101

8:11pm Tue 3 Jun 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

The strength of criticism lies in the weakness of the thing criticised.

The Mark-Down Mongrels are a symptom of the weakness, totally powerless to counter the arguments posed, but then in this case we are talking about a blatant lie.
The strength of criticism lies in the weakness of the thing criticised. The Mark-Down Mongrels are a symptom of the weakness, totally powerless to counter the arguments posed, but then in this case we are talking about a blatant lie. YOUWILLDOASISAY
  • Score: -79

8:27pm Tue 3 Jun 14

Al1017 says...

Today the van joined the road behind me from a lay-by just North of Riccall on the A19. It took the A64 eastbound.

This was 0830 - 0900 which are the times I presumed it would be outside a school. Clearly it wasn't.

Why not?
Today the van joined the road behind me from a lay-by just North of Riccall on the A19. It took the A64 eastbound. This was 0830 - 0900 which are the times I presumed it would be outside a school. Clearly it wasn't. Why not? Al1017
  • Score: -17

8:30pm Tue 3 Jun 14

Jack Ham says...

Oh dear.

Another bad week for CYC and York Labour.

So where are the inner circle who should be coming out to explain and take responsibility for this fiasco? Kersten, James, newly promoted David Levene?

Nowhere.

Why? Because they're either afraid to face the electorate or more likely, so complacent they feel they don't need to face the electorate.

Somebody with CYC is responsible for deciding where this van sits. Somebody decided to deviate from its original planned purpose. Somebody should be held accountable.

Maybe an FOI to ascertain how the locations are chosen?
Oh dear. Another bad week for CYC and York Labour. So where are the inner circle who should be coming out to explain and take responsibility for this fiasco? Kersten, James, newly promoted David Levene? Nowhere. Why? Because they're either afraid to face the electorate or more likely, so complacent they feel they don't need to face the electorate. Somebody with CYC is responsible for deciding where this van sits. Somebody decided to deviate from its original planned purpose. Somebody should be held accountable. Maybe an FOI to ascertain how the locations are chosen? Jack Ham
  • Score: 3

10:43pm Tue 3 Jun 14

Dave Ruddock says...

just a few things:
1, Does the driver of this vehicle a one man team and lives in Riccal.
2. Who or What department controls this vehicle.
3. I have seen from various pictures of this vehicle as one shows it being operated by a private firm and one shows it as a City Council vehicle.
4. from what i hear on the radio, even a spoken interview there not a real answer.

any one have any answers ?
just a few things: 1, Does the driver of this vehicle a one man team and lives in Riccal. 2. Who or What department controls this vehicle. 3. I have seen from various pictures of this vehicle as one shows it being operated by a private firm and one shows it as a City Council vehicle. 4. from what i hear on the radio, even a spoken interview there not a real answer. any one have any answers ? Dave Ruddock
  • Score: 15

11:13pm Tue 3 Jun 14

pault42 says...

Here we go again. The only way to look at this council is that 'Labour Is Always Right'. Or use its intials if it helps - L.I.A.R. Why can't they just try to be honest. If they want to be a profit making council with these schemes, tell us, stop trying to mask what you want to achieve and be OPEN, if they wanted to use this method for enforcement and safety around schools and other areas involving vulnerable road users I can't imagine any real opposition, most would be in favour I believe. Instead, we have a situation where the positives have been detracted from by false pretenses. Shame
Here we go again. The only way to look at this council is that 'Labour Is Always Right'. Or use its intials if it helps - L.I.A.R. Why can't they just try to be honest. If they want to be a profit making council with these schemes, tell us, stop trying to mask what you want to achieve and be OPEN, if they wanted to use this method for enforcement and safety around schools and other areas involving vulnerable road users I can't imagine any real opposition, most would be in favour I believe. Instead, we have a situation where the positives have been detracted from by false pretenses. Shame pault42
  • Score: -13

11:24pm Tue 3 Jun 14

joelwithatleast6characters says...

Presumably you all have access to the times that the tickets were issued based on your rants. I can't find that info on the council website. Could someone direct me there? The Press didn't bother to report that bit.
I must say though that the council have clearly said where the car will be used and it's not limited to schools so this 'mass deception' is pish. Just read the website and press releases.
I assume that most commentators (and The Press apparently) would prefer the car to prosecute outside schools and then sit idle for the rest of the day?
Good quality journalism or a boring attempt to stir controversy.
Oh and if Mr Amesbury is too traumatized by getting a ticket for parking in a no parking zone to visit the city centre then that's probably for the best. I only hope he is not in one of the new 20 mph zones or the poor soul might never leave his house!
Presumably you all have access to the times that the tickets were issued based on your rants. I can't find that info on the council website. Could someone direct me there? The Press didn't bother to report that bit. I must say though that the council have clearly said where the car will be used and it's not limited to schools so this 'mass deception' is pish. Just read the website and press releases. I assume that most commentators (and The Press apparently) would prefer the car to prosecute outside schools and then sit idle for the rest of the day? Good quality journalism or a boring attempt to stir controversy. Oh and if Mr Amesbury is too traumatized by getting a ticket for parking in a no parking zone to visit the city centre then that's probably for the best. I only hope he is not in one of the new 20 mph zones or the poor soul might never leave his house! joelwithatleast6characters
  • Score: -9

1:57am Wed 4 Jun 14

SRyork says...

I got a ticket on acomb road dropping off my elderly grandparent off I couldn't park outside as there was no spaces so I pulled up for less than a minuet on double yellows in pouring rain and a ticket showed up on my door step this morning
I got a ticket on acomb road dropping off my elderly grandparent off I couldn't park outside as there was no spaces so I pulled up for less than a minuet on double yellows in pouring rain and a ticket showed up on my door step this morning SRyork
  • Score: 29

7:28am Wed 4 Jun 14

Woody G Mellor says...

Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour!
Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour! Woody G Mellor
  • Score: -96

8:13am Wed 4 Jun 14

purelobo says...

hands up those who ever believed that this was a school patrol van.come on,one van for how many schools?this labour council have long ago abandoned any sense of sefving the residents of york and alexander is just looking for ways to top up his squandered income.
hands up those who ever believed that this was a school patrol van.come on,one van for how many schools?this labour council have long ago abandoned any sense of sefving the residents of york and alexander is just looking for ways to top up his squandered income. purelobo
  • Score: -83

9:02am Wed 4 Jun 14

WixiBoy says...

how is any one surprised?
there was never a chance that one camera van could cover all the schools given the nature of the problem (short time frame and multiple sites).
a much better approach would be to set up a web-site for people to upload photos of offenders , who could then be approached and warned of the error of their ways.
proper community involvement.
just think, it could be applied to other things like the drivers who do not understand how yellow box junctions work.
how is any one surprised? there was never a chance that one camera van could cover all the schools given the nature of the problem (short time frame and multiple sites). a much better approach would be to set up a web-site for people to upload photos of offenders , who could then be approached and warned of the error of their ways. proper community involvement. just think, it could be applied to other things like the drivers who do not understand how yellow box junctions work. WixiBoy
  • Score: 7

9:03am Wed 4 Jun 14

The Grim Reaper says...

This may be a simplistic response - BUT - we have the power to stop this vehicle being used. Don't park illegally, and you wont get a ticket. No tickets, no van. I am sounding more like Goody Two Pedals everyday....:-)
This may be a simplistic response - BUT - we have the power to stop this vehicle being used. Don't park illegally, and you wont get a ticket. No tickets, no van. I am sounding more like Goody Two Pedals everyday....:-) The Grim Reaper
  • Score: 2

9:08am Wed 4 Jun 14

sniper 9964 says...

SRyork wrote:
I got a ticket on acomb road dropping off my elderly grandparent off I couldn't park outside as there was no spaces so I pulled up for less than a minuet on double yellows in pouring rain and a ticket showed up on my door step this morning
You are allowedto drop off pick up on yellow lines. Appeal and yoy will win
[quote][p][bold]SRyork[/bold] wrote: I got a ticket on acomb road dropping off my elderly grandparent off I couldn't park outside as there was no spaces so I pulled up for less than a minuet on double yellows in pouring rain and a ticket showed up on my door step this morning[/p][/quote]You are allowedto drop off pick up on yellow lines. Appeal and yoy will win sniper 9964
  • Score: 13

9:09am Wed 4 Jun 14

sniper 9964 says...

So no tickets issued on blossom st where people park on yellows out side KFC ????
So no tickets issued on blossom st where people park on yellows out side KFC ???? sniper 9964
  • Score: 3

9:10am Wed 4 Jun 14

sniper 9964 says...

It should park up on taddy rd. Catch the drivers using the bus lane
It should park up on taddy rd. Catch the drivers using the bus lane sniper 9964
  • Score: 1

9:20am Wed 4 Jun 14

The Great Buda says...

Thecynic wrote:
Anyone who receives a ticket, (be it from the van or a warden) for parking illegally really hasn't got much of a leg to stand on when complaining. However, most of us know that there has been a massive amount of cars creating a safety issue around the schools of York, therefore it is disappointing to say the least, that (according to the released figures) there doesn't appear to be as much effort taken to try and rectify the problemsaround the schools first, before moving onto other streets.
Either the vast majority of these parents on the school run have become 'safety concious' overnight? or, the vehicle isn't spending as much time and effort in safeguarding the areas (and children) that it was intended for in the first place.
First reply, and pretty much spot on.
The council had better learn to start being honest, but alas I think thats wishfull thinking.
[quote][p][bold]Thecynic[/bold] wrote: Anyone who receives a ticket, (be it from the van or a warden) for parking illegally really hasn't got much of a leg to stand on when complaining. However, most of us know that there has been a massive amount of cars creating a safety issue around the schools of York, therefore it is disappointing to say the least, that (according to the released figures) there doesn't appear to be as much effort taken to try and rectify the problemsaround the schools first, before moving onto other streets. Either the vast majority of these parents on the school run have become 'safety concious' overnight? or, the vehicle isn't spending as much time and effort in safeguarding the areas (and children) that it was intended for in the first place.[/p][/quote]First reply, and pretty much spot on. The council had better learn to start being honest, but alas I think thats wishfull thinking. The Great Buda
  • Score: 9

9:23am Wed 4 Jun 14

YorkPatrol says...

Woody G Mellor wrote:
Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour!
You shouldn’t have ever voted Labour - Anyone with half a brain knows they are historically useless at all levels
[quote][p][bold]Woody G Mellor[/bold] wrote: Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour![/p][/quote]You shouldn’t have ever voted Labour - Anyone with half a brain knows they are historically useless at all levels YorkPatrol
  • Score: 13

9:27am Wed 4 Jun 14

meme says...

If the tickets given are in response to illegal parking then they are helping a situation somewhere and someone is being punished for illegal parking which can cause chaos. If we do something wrong and are caught no matter by who, or what we should not complain at the consequences
It does appear however that it should be used near schools at peak hours and then elsewhere during the day to maximise the return for the cost or perhaps school drivers have miraculously learnt their lesson and are not transgressing anymore!
If the tickets given are in response to illegal parking then they are helping a situation somewhere and someone is being punished for illegal parking which can cause chaos. If we do something wrong and are caught no matter by who, or what we should not complain at the consequences It does appear however that it should be used near schools at peak hours and then elsewhere during the day to maximise the return for the cost or perhaps school drivers have miraculously learnt their lesson and are not transgressing anymore! meme
  • Score: -5

12:15pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Cheeky face says...

Are the tickets for transgressing on no loading or clearway areas?
Near Garden Place there are some chargeable parking bays- if no space available in these then you take your chance. Yellow markings on pavements opposite double yellows mean different things.

Camden's web-site explains all variations-m and say they are open and honest! Well worth a look!

There are other transgessions by motorists in York but the council are directing the van driver to easy options, it appears.

I heard a contract firm operates the van, and the driver lives at Barmby on the Marsh. If the driver can choose their own hours and miss school parking controls then that needs looking at.

(Revenue from PCNs is not being collected for Coppergate. Decision on appeal by the council due any time soon. The council web-site states that Coppergate restriction will have alternative routes on signs leading to the Coppergate junctions.( I have not seen these! ) See Highways/Traffic enforcement page on the Cof Y web-site).

During the school holidays what will happen? Will the council/driver have more options to raise revenue.

HOW MANY OF THE FINES WERE FOR DANGEROUS PARKING?
WHAT % ARE York postoded registered keepers?
Are the tickets for transgressing on no loading or clearway areas? Near Garden Place there are some chargeable parking bays- if no space available in these then you take your chance. Yellow markings on pavements opposite double yellows mean different things. Camden's web-site explains all variations-m and say they are open and honest! Well worth a look! There are other transgessions by motorists in York but the council are directing the van driver to easy options, it appears. I heard a contract firm operates the van, and the driver lives at Barmby on the Marsh. If the driver can choose their own hours and miss school parking controls then that needs looking at. (Revenue from PCNs is not being collected for Coppergate. Decision on appeal by the council due any time soon. The council web-site states that Coppergate restriction will have alternative routes on signs leading to the Coppergate junctions.( I have not seen these! ) See Highways/Traffic enforcement page on the Cof Y web-site). During the school holidays what will happen? Will the council/driver have more options to raise revenue. HOW MANY OF THE FINES WERE FOR DANGEROUS PARKING? WHAT % ARE York postoded registered keepers? Cheeky face
  • Score: 0

12:52pm Wed 4 Jun 14

hokey cokey says...

Woody G Mellor wrote:
Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour!
Are you going to vote for a party that actively ignores traffic transgressions? Obviously from the comments from Chris Steward the Tories are touting for your vote. But I am sure as with all other politicians once in power he will have an about turn.
Garden Place was until a couple of weekends ago was used by buses to turn round. walmgate and Clifford Street are both narrow and used by many bus services.
Murton lane has many cars parked on it when there is a boot sale. Obviously all trying to avoid paying the 70p to get in to the ample parking provided!
As previus posters have said if you dont park on double yellows you wont get punished!!
[quote][p][bold]Woody G Mellor[/bold] wrote: Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour![/p][/quote]Are you going to vote for a party that actively ignores traffic transgressions? Obviously from the comments from Chris Steward the Tories are touting for your vote. But I am sure as with all other politicians once in power he will have an about turn. Garden Place was until a couple of weekends ago was used by buses to turn round. walmgate and Clifford Street are both narrow and used by many bus services. Murton lane has many cars parked on it when there is a boot sale. Obviously all trying to avoid paying the 70p to get in to the ample parking provided! As previus posters have said if you dont park on double yellows you wont get punished!! hokey cokey
  • Score: -6

1:29pm Wed 4 Jun 14

YorkPatrol says...

hokey cokey wrote:
Woody G Mellor wrote: Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour!
Are you going to vote for a party that actively ignores traffic transgressions? Obviously from the comments from Chris Steward the Tories are touting for your vote. But I am sure as with all other politicians once in power he will have an about turn. Garden Place was until a couple of weekends ago was used by buses to turn round. walmgate and Clifford Street are both narrow and used by many bus services. Murton lane has many cars parked on it when there is a boot sale. Obviously all trying to avoid paying the 70p to get in to the ample parking provided! As previus posters have said if you dont park on double yellows you wont get punished!!
"Are you going to vote for a party that actively ignores traffic transgressions"

Which party is that then?

10 points for an educated anf factual response
[quote][p][bold]hokey cokey[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Woody G Mellor[/bold] wrote: Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour![/p][/quote]Are you going to vote for a party that actively ignores traffic transgressions? Obviously from the comments from Chris Steward the Tories are touting for your vote. But I am sure as with all other politicians once in power he will have an about turn. Garden Place was until a couple of weekends ago was used by buses to turn round. walmgate and Clifford Street are both narrow and used by many bus services. Murton lane has many cars parked on it when there is a boot sale. Obviously all trying to avoid paying the 70p to get in to the ample parking provided! As previus posters have said if you dont park on double yellows you wont get punished!![/p][/quote]"Are you going to vote for a party that actively ignores traffic transgressions" Which party is that then? 10 points for an educated anf factual response YorkPatrol
  • Score: 1

1:33pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Stanley J Krammerhead III Jr says...

YorkPatrol wrote:
Woody G Mellor wrote:
Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour!
You shouldn’t have ever voted Labour - Anyone with half a brain knows they are historically useless at all levels
Really? Was Clement Attlee useless then? Even your beloved Thatcher said of him:

"...he was a serious man and a patriot. Quite contrary to the general tendency of politicians in the 1990s, he was all substance and no show..."
[quote][p][bold]YorkPatrol[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Woody G Mellor[/bold] wrote: Next local election for the first time in my life, I will NOT be voting Labour![/p][/quote]You shouldn’t have ever voted Labour - Anyone with half a brain knows they are historically useless at all levels[/p][/quote]Really? Was Clement Attlee useless then? Even your beloved Thatcher said of him: "...he was a serious man and a patriot. Quite contrary to the general tendency of politicians in the 1990s, he was all substance and no show..." Stanley J Krammerhead III Jr
  • Score: 1

1:44pm Wed 4 Jun 14

RealMcoy says...

i dont think there would be so many complaints if it was actually doing what it was meant to be doing, making roads around schools safer, if it caught other motorists on its way to or from the school area then fair enough but it doesnt seem to be the case e.g. Al1017 seeing it on the A64.
Why dont the council just admit they are using it to make some extra money, but they wont, same way they went on and on about Lendal bridge being a good idea and not listening/seeing congestion moving elsewhere just so they could keep the revenue coming in to pointlessly repave half the city centre when 90% of the roads in the city are in such a diabolical state with pot holes
i dont think there would be so many complaints if it was actually doing what it was meant to be doing, making roads around schools safer, if it caught other motorists on its way to or from the school area then fair enough but it doesnt seem to be the case e.g. Al1017 seeing it on the A64. Why dont the council just admit they are using it to make some extra money, but they wont, same way they went on and on about Lendal bridge being a good idea and not listening/seeing congestion moving elsewhere just so they could keep the revenue coming in to pointlessly repave half the city centre when 90% of the roads in the city are in such a diabolical state with pot holes RealMcoy
  • Score: 3

1:48pm Wed 4 Jun 14

the original Homer says...

I suspect most people being caught by the camera van don't know the highway code.

It would be difficult for the camera to get good evidence for parking on double yellow lines and the Council have already said it isn't being used for that purpose.

Garden Place might have double yellow lines, but it also has "no waiting" signs (Big blue circles with a red diagonal), I suspect the tickets will have been for waiting in a no waiting area, not for parking on double yellow lines.

The camera van is targeting the areas with the extra signs.

Easy answer, read the highway code and look out for those extra signs. You probably learnt them for your driving test and forgot them the day after.
I suspect most people being caught by the camera van don't know the highway code. It would be difficult for the camera to get good evidence for parking on double yellow lines and the Council have already said it isn't being used for that purpose. Garden Place might have double yellow lines, but it also has "no waiting" signs (Big blue circles with a red diagonal), I suspect the tickets will have been for waiting in a no waiting area, not for parking on double yellow lines. The camera van is targeting the areas with the extra signs. Easy answer, read the highway code and look out for those extra signs. You probably learnt them for your driving test and forgot them the day after. the original Homer
  • Score: -1

2:06pm Wed 4 Jun 14

york_chap says...

Like others have said, if the van was being used solely or primarily to target bad parking outside school gates - which is what the council actually told us it was intended for, no rational person would have a problem with it. Likewise, if the council had stated their true intention from the outset - that the van wouldn't really target schools and that actually it's primary puprose would be to photograph general parking misdemeanours in random streets, then fair enough. It's the council's constant dishonesty that most people are sick of.

The council said this van was going to be used (and was needed) to tackle illegal parking outside schools during the 'school run'. These figures clearly show that the council couldn't give two hoots about improving safety for schoolchildren. Looking at the top 10 locations; none bar Minster Yard are directly outside schools. Blossom Street is mentioned as having a school nearby - the only school around there is All Saints and their kids' entrance is on Nunnery Lane, not Blossom Street.

People's resentment for the camera van is quite similar in many ways to that expressed towards the blanket 20mph zones. If the council wants to penalise bad parking and make the traffic move slower (and driving appear less convenient etc),then it should just say so. They need to stop hiding behind the health and safety mantra and just be honest with us.

The council's presumption that none of us are actually bright enough to see through the 'save the children/save the pedestrians' veil is staggeringly arrogant. I wonder if Labour will get ANY votes at the next election?
Like others have said, if the van was being used solely or primarily to target bad parking outside school gates - which is what the council actually told us it was intended for, no rational person would have a problem with it. Likewise, if the council had stated their true intention from the outset - that the van wouldn't really target schools and that actually it's primary puprose would be to photograph general parking misdemeanours in random streets, then fair enough. It's the council's constant dishonesty that most people are sick of. The council said this van was going to be used (and was needed) to tackle illegal parking outside schools during the 'school run'. These figures clearly show that the council couldn't give two hoots about improving safety for schoolchildren. Looking at the top 10 locations; none bar Minster Yard are directly outside schools. Blossom Street is mentioned as having a school nearby - the only school around there is All Saints and their kids' entrance is on Nunnery Lane, not Blossom Street. People's resentment for the camera van is quite similar in many ways to that expressed towards the blanket 20mph zones. If the council wants to penalise bad parking and make the traffic move slower (and driving appear less convenient etc),then it should just say so. They need to stop hiding behind the health and safety mantra and just be honest with us. The council's presumption that none of us are actually bright enough to see through the 'save the children/save the pedestrians' veil is staggeringly arrogant. I wonder if Labour will get ANY votes at the next election? york_chap
  • Score: -75

2:07pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Kelvar says...

Jack Ham wrote:
Oh dear.

Another bad week for CYC and York Labour.

So where are the inner circle who should be coming out to explain and take responsibility for this fiasco? Kersten, James, newly promoted David Levene?

Nowhere.

Why? Because they're either afraid to face the electorate or more likely, so complacent they feel they don't need to face the electorate.

Somebody with CYC is responsible for deciding where this van sits. Somebody decided to deviate from its original planned purpose. Somebody should be held accountable.

Maybe an FOI to ascertain how the locations are chosen?
Looking at your last sentence! Ha Ha Ha - don't hold your breath...

Read this first: http://www.yorkpress
.co.uk/news/11255545
.Long_wait_for_answe
rs_sparks_secrecy_ro
w_in_York/
[quote][p][bold]Jack Ham[/bold] wrote: Oh dear. Another bad week for CYC and York Labour. So where are the inner circle who should be coming out to explain and take responsibility for this fiasco? Kersten, James, newly promoted David Levene? Nowhere. Why? Because they're either afraid to face the electorate or more likely, so complacent they feel they don't need to face the electorate. Somebody with CYC is responsible for deciding where this van sits. Somebody decided to deviate from its original planned purpose. Somebody should be held accountable. Maybe an FOI to ascertain how the locations are chosen?[/p][/quote]Looking at your last sentence! Ha Ha Ha - don't hold your breath... Read this first: http://www.yorkpress .co.uk/news/11255545 .Long_wait_for_answe rs_sparks_secrecy_ro w_in_York/ Kelvar
  • Score: -70

3:00pm Wed 4 Jun 14

Cheeky face says...

Original Homer is spot on. Clearways need lots of ticked boxes before being designated as such. Traffic flow is the council's responsibility, and they are doing what they have been mandated to do by the govt, but what else can they do re traffic flow? Turn of lights at 10pm for 7 hours is an option; as is making P and R so much cheaper for a family, that cars left ar=t home or P and R sites. The council have the power but are they merely doing things that create revenue?

No waiting areas appear to be areas targeted by the council so as to use spare capacity of the contracted out van. Their web site includes the info.
Whether they can fairly and safely catch box junction transgressions is unknown. Of course box junction markings need to be clear - the one at Scarcroft Rd/The Mount is worn out. I reported it in Sept 2013!!

They can use registered keeper info for warnings if leading to a fine; so can the van catch "no obligatory lights working" and send yellow card warning letters?
Original Homer is spot on. Clearways need lots of ticked boxes before being designated as such. Traffic flow is the council's responsibility, and they are doing what they have been mandated to do by the govt, but what else can they do re traffic flow? Turn of lights at 10pm for 7 hours is an option; as is making P and R so much cheaper for a family, that cars left ar=t home or P and R sites. The council have the power but are they merely doing things that create revenue? No waiting areas appear to be areas targeted by the council so as to use spare capacity of the contracted out van. Their web site includes the info. Whether they can fairly and safely catch box junction transgressions is unknown. Of course box junction markings need to be clear - the one at Scarcroft Rd/The Mount is worn out. I reported it in Sept 2013!! They can use registered keeper info for warnings if leading to a fine; so can the van catch "no obligatory lights working" and send yellow card warning letters? Cheeky face
  • Score: -63

5:17pm Wed 4 Jun 14

notpedallingpaul says...

YOUWILLDOASISAY wrote:
The war against the motorist continues, only now Labour have openly added lies and contempt to their arsenal of anti car weapons.

Well done Jay -76 in 8 minutes.
We all new that this spy van was not going to be used solely for the benefit of schools, and the council always had an ulterior motive in mind when they purchased the spy van - I can't bring myself to say safety van because that's not what it is - as far as the comment scoring goes, if you remember I wrote to the press a while back:

I am an avid reader of the news articles on the press web site, and the comments associated with them.
However the "thumbs up" "thumbs down" facility which I assume is supposed to relate to how many agree or disagree with whatever issue is being discussed puzzles me in that there appears to be huge differentials for it to be a true reflection of opinion.
Quite a few commenters it would seem are of an opinion that the system is being abused by a third party or parties - to give the wrong impression - by vastly under scoring or over scoring comments on contentious topics, such as the recent Lendal Bridge issue for example.
Would it not be better for the Press to update its web site and remove this facility, or do they condone the practice of what is to me a blatant manipulation of the system in order to make topics look as though they have huge support or no support at all.

The press replied:

We are aware that this is being abused and mostly on stories concerning City of York Council. This service is provided to us by a central team that services all of the papers across the country that are owned by our parent company Newsquest. We are currently talking to them about this.

Regards
Steve Hughes
Editor

Well it looks like they still allow the council infiltrator to adjust the scoring!
[quote][p][bold]YOUWILLDOASISAY[/bold] wrote: The war against the motorist continues, only now Labour have openly added lies and contempt to their arsenal of anti car weapons. Well done Jay -76 in 8 minutes.[/p][/quote]We all new that this spy van was not going to be used solely for the benefit of schools, and the council always had an ulterior motive in mind when they purchased the spy van - I can't bring myself to say safety van because that's not what it is - as far as the comment scoring goes, if you remember I wrote to the press a while back: I am an avid reader of the news articles on the press web site, and the comments associated with them. However the "thumbs up" "thumbs down" facility which I assume is supposed to relate to how many agree or disagree with whatever issue is being discussed puzzles me in that there appears to be huge differentials for it to be a true reflection of opinion. Quite a few commenters it would seem are of an opinion that the system is being abused by a third party or parties - to give the wrong impression - by vastly under scoring or over scoring comments on contentious topics, such as the recent Lendal Bridge issue for example. Would it not be better for the Press to update its web site and remove this facility, or do they condone the practice of what is to me a blatant manipulation of the system in order to make topics look as though they have huge support or no support at all. The press replied: We are aware that this is being abused and mostly on stories concerning City of York Council. This service is provided to us by a central team that services all of the papers across the country that are owned by our parent company Newsquest. We are currently talking to them about this. Regards Steve Hughes Editor Well it looks like they still allow the council infiltrator to adjust the scoring! notpedallingpaul
  • Score: -30

5:24pm Wed 4 Jun 14

notpedallingpaul says...

pault42 wrote:
Here we go again. The only way to look at this council is that 'Labour Is Always Right'. Or use its intials if it helps - L.I.A.R. Why can't they just try to be honest. If they want to be a profit making council with these schemes, tell us, stop trying to mask what you want to achieve and be OPEN, if they wanted to use this method for enforcement and safety around schools and other areas involving vulnerable road users I can't imagine any real opposition, most would be in favour I believe. Instead, we have a situation where the positives have been detracted from by false pretenses. Shame
LIAR, a fitting acronym for the labrador's
[quote][p][bold]pault42[/bold] wrote: Here we go again. The only way to look at this council is that 'Labour Is Always Right'. Or use its intials if it helps - L.I.A.R. Why can't they just try to be honest. If they want to be a profit making council with these schemes, tell us, stop trying to mask what you want to achieve and be OPEN, if they wanted to use this method for enforcement and safety around schools and other areas involving vulnerable road users I can't imagine any real opposition, most would be in favour I believe. Instead, we have a situation where the positives have been detracted from by false pretenses. Shame[/p][/quote]LIAR, a fitting acronym for the labrador's notpedallingpaul
  • Score: -18

4:18am Thu 5 Jun 14

Magicman! says...

If the council want to make in some quick revenue then paint the cycle lanes along Crichton Avenue as mandatory cycle lanes (solid white lines) and then semd the cameravan along there at 11am and 4pm, there will be a green fiat punto and 'Numark' ford transit van that will get fined every single time. If the fine is only £40, sending the van along there and just getting those 2 vehicles twice a day is £160... wouldn't take too long to be making enough money to then justify the council wasting money on the 20mph signs or whatever other random/insane (delete as appropriate) ideas they get.
If the council want to make in some quick revenue then paint the cycle lanes along Crichton Avenue as mandatory cycle lanes (solid white lines) and then semd the cameravan along there at 11am and 4pm, there will be a green fiat punto and 'Numark' ford transit van that will get fined every single time. If the fine is only £40, sending the van along there and just getting those 2 vehicles twice a day is £160... wouldn't take too long to be making enough money to then justify the council wasting money on the 20mph signs or whatever other random/insane (delete as appropriate) ideas they get. Magicman!
  • Score: -2

7:24am Thu 5 Jun 14

notpedallingpaul says...

Magicman! wrote:
If the council want to make in some quick revenue then paint the cycle lanes along Crichton Avenue as mandatory cycle lanes (solid white lines) and then semd the cameravan along there at 11am and 4pm, there will be a green fiat punto and 'Numark' ford transit van that will get fined every single time. If the fine is only £40, sending the van along there and just getting those 2 vehicles twice a day is £160... wouldn't take too long to be making enough money to then justify the council wasting money on the 20mph signs or whatever other random/insane (delete as appropriate) ideas they get.
Can I ask you a question with getting my head bitten off - I don't know the area you refer to, but if the cycle lane is painted outside their houses, and they have no other alternative to on-street parking, where are they supposed to park, just a question.
[quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: If the council want to make in some quick revenue then paint the cycle lanes along Crichton Avenue as mandatory cycle lanes (solid white lines) and then semd the cameravan along there at 11am and 4pm, there will be a green fiat punto and 'Numark' ford transit van that will get fined every single time. If the fine is only £40, sending the van along there and just getting those 2 vehicles twice a day is £160... wouldn't take too long to be making enough money to then justify the council wasting money on the 20mph signs or whatever other random/insane (delete as appropriate) ideas they get.[/p][/quote]Can I ask you a question with getting my head bitten off - I don't know the area you refer to, but if the cycle lane is painted outside their houses, and they have no other alternative to on-street parking, where are they supposed to park, just a question. notpedallingpaul
  • Score: -58

8:07am Thu 5 Jun 14

the original Homer says...

Magicman! wrote:
If the council want to make in some quick revenue then paint the cycle lanes along Crichton Avenue as mandatory cycle lanes (solid white lines) and then semd the cameravan along there at 11am and 4pm, there will be a green fiat punto and 'Numark' ford transit van that will get fined every single time. If the fine is only £40, sending the van along there and just getting those 2 vehicles twice a day is £160... wouldn't take too long to be making enough money to then justify the council wasting money on the 20mph signs or whatever other random/insane (delete as appropriate) ideas they get.
Not sure about your logic there.

It sounds like those vehicles are legally parked, because there aren't any solid lines there at the moment.
[quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: If the council want to make in some quick revenue then paint the cycle lanes along Crichton Avenue as mandatory cycle lanes (solid white lines) and then semd the cameravan along there at 11am and 4pm, there will be a green fiat punto and 'Numark' ford transit van that will get fined every single time. If the fine is only £40, sending the van along there and just getting those 2 vehicles twice a day is £160... wouldn't take too long to be making enough money to then justify the council wasting money on the 20mph signs or whatever other random/insane (delete as appropriate) ideas they get.[/p][/quote]Not sure about your logic there. It sounds like those vehicles are legally parked, because there aren't any solid lines there at the moment. the original Homer
  • Score: -60

8:43am Thu 5 Jun 14

Cheeky face says...

Cycle lanes (on the road)in Eastfield, Scarborough have a plethora of cars parked on them. No yellow lines. No fines neither.

On the new business estate the cycle lanes are on the pavement. All looking super. No businesses on some of the spurred roads yet.

There must be many transgressions that the camera-car can chase.

How many fines are definitely adj to schools?
Cycle lanes (on the road)in Eastfield, Scarborough have a plethora of cars parked on them. No yellow lines. No fines neither. On the new business estate the cycle lanes are on the pavement. All looking super. No businesses on some of the spurred roads yet. There must be many transgressions that the camera-car can chase. How many fines are definitely adj to schools? Cheeky face
  • Score: -48

9:28am Thu 5 Jun 14

retrorigg says...

anyone noticed how this story switches from camera car and then to camera van, ive seen a picture of a toyota IQ and then this picture of a van both said to be the camera van/car..how many vehicles have they got actually doing this job ????
anyone noticed how this story switches from camera car and then to camera van, ive seen a picture of a toyota IQ and then this picture of a van both said to be the camera van/car..how many vehicles have they got actually doing this job ???? retrorigg
  • Score: -20

7:10pm Sat 7 Jun 14

A Resident of York says...

Yet I still haven't had a response to the photographic evidence I have showing the safety van stopped on double yellow lines opposite school zig-zags with the driver on the phone. And again driving whist on the phone.

I have now requested under FOIA how many fines were issued on that day by that van. Give it 6 months I may have an answer
Yet I still haven't had a response to the photographic evidence I have showing the safety van stopped on double yellow lines opposite school zig-zags with the driver on the phone. And again driving whist on the phone. I have now requested under FOIA how many fines were issued on that day by that van. Give it 6 months I may have an answer A Resident of York
  • Score: 0

6:48am Sat 21 Jun 14

notpedallingpaul says...

Fantastic news - the widespread use of static and car-mounted cameras to catch drivers who park illegally in England is to be banned, the government has announced.

It says so-called "spy cars" have been used as a "cash cow" by councils, and it wants to end the "plague" of parking fines being sent in the post.

Instead traffic wardens will have to fix penalty notices to windscreens.

Councils will still be able to use the cameras near schools, in bus lanes and bus stops, and on "red routes".

Currently, some councils can use CCTV cameras or "approved devices" to enforce parking restrictions, under Labour's 2004 Traffic Management Act.

The government says nine million parking fines are now issued every year by local authorities in England and wants to rein-in "over-zealous parking enforcement practices".

The ban follows a three-month consultation
Fantastic news - the widespread use of static and car-mounted cameras to catch drivers who park illegally in England is to be banned, the government has announced. It says so-called "spy cars" have been used as a "cash cow" by councils, and it wants to end the "plague" of parking fines being sent in the post. Instead traffic wardens will have to fix penalty notices to windscreens. Councils will still be able to use the cameras near schools, in bus lanes and bus stops, and on "red routes". Currently, some councils can use CCTV cameras or "approved devices" to enforce parking restrictions, under Labour's 2004 Traffic Management Act. The government says nine million parking fines are now issued every year by local authorities in England and wants to rein-in "over-zealous parking enforcement practices". The ban follows a three-month consultation notpedallingpaul
  • Score: 0

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