Medical centre planned for York drunks

York Press: Medical centre planned for York drunks Medical centre planned for York drunks

A MEDICAL centre for drunk people could be set up in York at weekends to ease pressure on paramedics and the city’s hospital.

The centre would provide treatment and a safe place for people who have drunk too much, a City of York Council draft report has recommended. It would be manned by police, paramedics, emergency care practitioners and volunteers from Street Angels.

The idea could follow the example of a centre in a former church in Cardiff, where patients can sleep off the effects of alcohol.

A report due to be discussed this week suggests the council inquires about opening a weekend treatment and recovery centre to stop drunk people putting a “disporportionate burden” on health services.

The report said: “Members recognised that an ambulance crew caught up dealing with an antisocial or alcohol-related incident that could have been avoided could be delayed from reaching someone with a more serious life-threatening condition such as a heart attack.”

Such a unit would provide an alternative for people who did not really need the emergency department, it said.

Two committee members spent two nights in York’s emergency department in November and recorded people being sick and sleeping off the effects of drinking. A spot check at midnight found 20 people who need not have been there.

The head of emergency operations at Yorkshire Ambulance Service, meanwhile, said he had witnessed as many as 14 ambulances waiting outside the hospital on a weekend night.

Demand on the Yorkshire Ambulance Service increases by 28 per cent at the weekends. Lobby group Alcohol Concern has supported the idea of a centre but said the reasons why people were getting so drunk should be tackled as well.

A spokesman said: “The Cardiff alcohol treatment centre has taken a lot of pressure off A&E at the city’s main hospital. Many of the people picked up drunk in the city centre simply need rehydrating and a sleep, and treating them on the spot can free up ambulances to deal with genuine emergencies.”

An audit of the York Hospital emergency department in 2011 found six per cent of day-time attendances and 20 per cent at night involved alcohol.

The report cites the example of a man aged 29, who was taken into A&E so drunk he could not stand, repeatedly fell over and urinated all over the cubicle, blocking a bed for five hours.

Street Angels, the church-led volunteers who help look after vulnerable and/or drunk people on Friday and Saturday nights in York, should also continue to be supported, the draft report recommended.


Easing the pressure on A&Es

CARDIFF’S £85,000 centre has worked to ease pressure on A&E services since opening in 2012, it has been reported.

The centre, which is manned by emergency practitioners, medical assistants and a police officer who deals with any violent disturbances, sees many visitors hooked up to drips to be treated for excessive alcohol intake.

The triage project is a joint venture between Cardiff and Vale of Glamorgan councils and Cardiff and Vale University Health Board, and has also received support from authorities including South Wales Police.

Local police have said officials from Holland and Vienna had looked to learn from the idea.

Comments (38)

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11:42am Mon 17 Feb 14

yorkandproud says...

That's all well and good, but surely these "drunks" will have to pay for this service.
That's all well and good, but surely these "drunks" will have to pay for this service. yorkandproud

11:43am Mon 17 Feb 14

nowthen says...

It sounds like a good idea , as long as those who are admitted are made to pay for their stay.
It sounds like a good idea , as long as those who are admitted are made to pay for their stay. nowthen

11:50am Mon 17 Feb 14

Loollah says...

Whilst it is a good idea to help ease the strain on A & E and Ambulance services, it may not encourage the more reckless few to take more responsability for their drinking! I'm sure there'll be a handful of people out there who will go out drinking to excess at the weekend, not worrying about taking care of themselves or getting home safely because they are safe in the knowledge that this service will pick them up, give them a bed for the night and rehydrate them.
Whilst it is a good idea to help ease the strain on A & E and Ambulance services, it may not encourage the more reckless few to take more responsability for their drinking! I'm sure there'll be a handful of people out there who will go out drinking to excess at the weekend, not worrying about taking care of themselves or getting home safely because they are safe in the knowledge that this service will pick them up, give them a bed for the night and rehydrate them. Loollah

11:55am Mon 17 Feb 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in...

Other than them sounds like a good idea.
i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea. Archiebold the 1st

11:56am Mon 17 Feb 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

Loollah wrote:
Whilst it is a good idea to help ease the strain on A & E and Ambulance services, it may not encourage the more reckless few to take more responsability for their drinking! I'm sure there'll be a handful of people out there who will go out drinking to excess at the weekend, not worrying about taking care of themselves or getting home safely because they are safe in the knowledge that this service will pick them up, give them a bed for the night and rehydrate them.
i dont think anyone would go out with that frame of mind... "oh lets get wrecked tonight make a fool of myself so i can stay in a free bed"
[quote][p][bold]Loollah[/bold] wrote: Whilst it is a good idea to help ease the strain on A & E and Ambulance services, it may not encourage the more reckless few to take more responsability for their drinking! I'm sure there'll be a handful of people out there who will go out drinking to excess at the weekend, not worrying about taking care of themselves or getting home safely because they are safe in the knowledge that this service will pick them up, give them a bed for the night and rehydrate them.[/p][/quote]i dont think anyone would go out with that frame of mind... "oh lets get wrecked tonight make a fool of myself so i can stay in a free bed" Archiebold the 1st

12:04pm Mon 17 Feb 14

SR0843 says...

Could be a good use of the big ex-Methodist Church by the lights at the Clarence Street / Wigginton Road junction...though there would be a certain irony as Methodists would be the least likely to need its services.
Could be a good use of the big ex-Methodist Church by the lights at the Clarence Street / Wigginton Road junction...though there would be a certain irony as Methodists would be the least likely to need its services. SR0843

12:12pm Mon 17 Feb 14

ianyork says...

This must be self - funding.
I suggest we bring back the stocks. By so doing we would have created a low cost system and created a tourist attraction
This must be self - funding. I suggest we bring back the stocks. By so doing we would have created a low cost system and created a tourist attraction ianyork

12:22pm Mon 17 Feb 14

CaroleBaines says...

Bit of strong headline - labelling people as 'drunks' helps nobody, surely?
Bit of strong headline - labelling people as 'drunks' helps nobody, surely? CaroleBaines

12:30pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Zetkin says...

If you force people to pay for the centre's services, they'll refuse to go there and will end up passing out in the street or going to A&E and recreating the current problems.

If it's an NHS service it must be free.

If the stats are accurate, it'll pay for itself in the amount of paramedics' and doctors' time saved. Just budnling them into the back of a police van or letting them fall in the river is no answer.

Alcohol Concern are dead right to highlight the need to address the reasons people are drinking themselves into oblivion.
If you force people to pay for the centre's services, they'll refuse to go there and will end up passing out in the street or going to A&E and recreating the current problems. If it's an NHS service it must be free. If the stats are accurate, it'll pay for itself in the amount of paramedics' and doctors' time saved. Just budnling them into the back of a police van or letting them fall in the river is no answer. Alcohol Concern are dead right to highlight the need to address the reasons people are drinking themselves into oblivion. Zetkin

12:48pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Teabag1 says...

Archiebold the 1st wrote:
i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in...

Other than them sounds like a good idea.
how can you say you 'hate' them, you need to get a grip and grow the **** up.
[quote][p][bold]Archiebold the 1st[/bold] wrote: i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea.[/p][/quote]how can you say you 'hate' them, you need to get a grip and grow the **** up. Teabag1

12:52pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

Teabag1 wrote:
Archiebold the 1st wrote: i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea.
how can you say you 'hate' them, you need to get a grip and grow the **** up.
Becasue its like young people need guardians around town when in fact they are adults and dont! I dont see day angels for the eldery who actually struggle to walk... so no wake up.
[quote][p][bold]Teabag1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Archiebold the 1st[/bold] wrote: i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea.[/p][/quote]how can you say you 'hate' them, you need to get a grip and grow the **** up.[/p][/quote]Becasue its like young people need guardians around town when in fact they are adults and dont! I dont see day angels for the eldery who actually struggle to walk... so no wake up. Archiebold the 1st

12:55pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Not-Dotty says...

If you are so drunk you need an ambulance, you're too drunk to have been sold the alcohol.
A better solution would be for the police and council to enforce licencing laws and close down all the establishments that sell alcohol to the completely inebreated.
If you are so drunk you need an ambulance, you're too drunk to have been sold the alcohol. A better solution would be for the police and council to enforce licencing laws and close down all the establishments that sell alcohol to the completely inebreated. Not-Dotty

1:05pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Salsaman says...

Out of interest, does anyone know what it costs when an idividual is taken to A&E due to being drunk?
I'm thinking that there must be a couple of PC's time, ambulance crew and a couple of nurses/Dr's involved at least.
Out of interest, does anyone know what it costs when an idividual is taken to A&E due to being drunk? I'm thinking that there must be a couple of PC's time, ambulance crew and a couple of nurses/Dr's involved at least. Salsaman

1:11pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

Salsaman wrote:
Out of interest, does anyone know what it costs when an idividual is taken to A&E due to being drunk? I'm thinking that there must be a couple of PC's time, ambulance crew and a couple of nurses/Dr's involved at least.
a lot... but not sure we can get the info as they all would have been on duty anyway so would have cost the same if an incident happend or not...

rough guess £250 in wages etcc more if they are in over night etc.
[quote][p][bold]Salsaman[/bold] wrote: Out of interest, does anyone know what it costs when an idividual is taken to A&E due to being drunk? I'm thinking that there must be a couple of PC's time, ambulance crew and a couple of nurses/Dr's involved at least.[/p][/quote]a lot... but not sure we can get the info as they all would have been on duty anyway so would have cost the same if an incident happend or not... rough guess £250 in wages etcc more if they are in over night etc. Archiebold the 1st

1:17pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Big Bad Wolf says...

Rightly or wrongly the NHS offers a free service at point of need, so if these people need medical attention (be it at Casualty or this proposed centre) it will be free.
We cannot start identifying some injuries / conditions as covered and others as not.
Rightly or wrongly the NHS offers a free service at point of need, so if these people need medical attention (be it at Casualty or this proposed centre) it will be free. We cannot start identifying some injuries / conditions as covered and others as not. Big Bad Wolf

1:27pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Boadicea says...

Archiebold the 1st wrote:
i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in...

Other than them sounds like a good idea.
It seems as if they do.
[quote][p][bold]Archiebold the 1st[/bold] wrote: i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea.[/p][/quote]It seems as if they do. Boadicea

1:29pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Zetkin says...

Quite right Wolf

If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke.

There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air.

What a load of cobblers.

The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.
Quite right Wolf If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke. There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air. What a load of cobblers. The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin. Zetkin

1:43pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Archiebold the 1st says...

Boadicea wrote:
Archiebold the 1st wrote: i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea.
It seems as if they do.
why what can a street angel do for someone that their mates can't/won't? lets face it growing up is about learning and if you get in a state you learn. getting told by someone who is a simliar age to your parents does not get any message across.

And besides the people in the worst state around town are usually the older male who doesnt get the chance to go out as much so makes the most of it... i'd rather the street angels went out during the day and helped people who really needed it.
[quote][p][bold]Boadicea[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Archiebold the 1st[/bold] wrote: i hate street angels... get over it people like to have a laugh. They do not need nosey neighbours wondering around butting in... Other than them sounds like a good idea.[/p][/quote]It seems as if they do.[/p][/quote]why what can a street angel do for someone that their mates can't/won't? lets face it growing up is about learning and if you get in a state you learn. getting told by someone who is a simliar age to your parents does not get any message across. And besides the people in the worst state around town are usually the older male who doesnt get the chance to go out as much so makes the most of it... i'd rather the street angels went out during the day and helped people who really needed it. Archiebold the 1st

1:48pm Mon 17 Feb 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

Should they be charged for the service ?.

Probably not.

Should they be educated like speeding drivers, probably yes.

Make them watch video of their situation and maybe 2 nights with the street angels seeing and dealing directly with the kind of situation they caused.
Should they be charged for the service ?. Probably not. Should they be educated like speeding drivers, probably yes. Make them watch video of their situation and maybe 2 nights with the street angels seeing and dealing directly with the kind of situation they caused. YOUWILLDOASISAY

2:18pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Pedro says...

I have seen these centres in action. They have them in German too. It is a form of drunk tank. They lay them on mattresses and doctors/nurses keep an eye on them so they don't choke on their own vomit. Some people spend every weekend in there. Drink. Pass out. Taken there. Start again.
I have seen these centres in action. They have them in German too. It is a form of drunk tank. They lay them on mattresses and doctors/nurses keep an eye on them so they don't choke on their own vomit. Some people spend every weekend in there. Drink. Pass out. Taken there. Start again. Pedro

3:17pm Mon 17 Feb 14

bolero says...

Tackle the cause not the result. Some revision of the licencing laws are needed and revoking of licences when those who are obviously drunk are sold even more in the interests of profit. Licencing authorities also need to heed the warnings and cautions that are passed to them by the police when considering alcohol sales at ridiculous hours and at supermarkets. Why take up space and time for these drunken sots. Just hang them up to dry in the grounds of West Offices.
Tackle the cause not the result. Some revision of the licencing laws are needed and revoking of licences when those who are obviously drunk are sold even more in the interests of profit. Licencing authorities also need to heed the warnings and cautions that are passed to them by the police when considering alcohol sales at ridiculous hours and at supermarkets. Why take up space and time for these drunken sots. Just hang them up to dry in the grounds of West Offices. bolero

3:47pm Mon 17 Feb 14

YorkPatrol says...

Zetkin wrote:
Quite right Wolf If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke. There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air. What a load of cobblers. The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.
Please are FAT because they eat too much not because they drive.

Walking 5 miles a day will make no difference if you follow it up with 5 Big Macs, 6 litres of coke and a Kebab
[quote][p][bold]Zetkin[/bold] wrote: Quite right Wolf If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke. There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air. What a load of cobblers. The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.[/p][/quote]Please are FAT because they eat too much not because they drive. Walking 5 miles a day will make no difference if you follow it up with 5 Big Macs, 6 litres of coke and a Kebab YorkPatrol

3:48pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Big Bad Wolf says...

YOUWILLDOASISAY wrote:
Should they be charged for the service ?.

Probably not.

Should they be educated like speeding drivers, probably yes.

Make them watch video of their situation and maybe 2 nights with the street angels seeing and dealing directly with the kind of situation they caused.
This would cost even more money...

AND how would you force them to watch the video? There are far worst things going on...

I am in no way condoning their behaviour simply pointing out that there is no way of changing it short of having the police arrest them for drunkenness and fining through the courts.
[quote][p][bold]YOUWILLDOASISAY[/bold] wrote: Should they be charged for the service ?. Probably not. Should they be educated like speeding drivers, probably yes. Make them watch video of their situation and maybe 2 nights with the street angels seeing and dealing directly with the kind of situation they caused.[/p][/quote]This would cost even more money... AND how would you force them to watch the video? There are far worst things going on... I am in no way condoning their behaviour simply pointing out that there is no way of changing it short of having the police arrest them for drunkenness and fining through the courts. Big Bad Wolf

3:49pm Mon 17 Feb 14

YorkPatrol says...

YorkPatrol wrote:
Zetkin wrote: Quite right Wolf If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke. There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air. What a load of cobblers. The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.
Please are FAT because they eat too much not because they drive. Walking 5 miles a day will make no difference if you follow it up with 5 Big Macs, 6 litres of coke and a Kebab
People even.....
[quote][p][bold]YorkPatrol[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Zetkin[/bold] wrote: Quite right Wolf If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke. There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air. What a load of cobblers. The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.[/p][/quote]Please are FAT because they eat too much not because they drive. Walking 5 miles a day will make no difference if you follow it up with 5 Big Macs, 6 litres of coke and a Kebab[/p][/quote]People even..... YorkPatrol

5:36pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Dan Atkinson says...

I personally thing that this is a brilliant idea! I've seen them working very well abroad. Drunks head there if they're unable to get safely home and are given somewhere warm and safe to sleep it off.

They're looked after to make sure they don't get worse due to alcohol poisoning or drugs.

In the morning, they're handed the bill and sent on their merry way into the hellish light of day. The systems, once set up, tend to cost very little.

I'll happily admit that they don't tend to be 100% self-funded, but then, they so much cheaper than taking up vital A+E beds and the time of our invaluable paramedics.
I personally thing that this is a brilliant idea! I've seen them working very well abroad. Drunks head there if they're unable to get safely home and are given somewhere warm and safe to sleep it off. They're looked after to make sure they don't get worse due to alcohol poisoning or drugs. In the morning, they're handed the bill and sent on their merry way into the hellish light of day. The systems, once set up, tend to cost very little. I'll happily admit that they don't tend to be 100% self-funded, but then, they so much cheaper than taking up vital A+E beds and the time of our invaluable paramedics. Dan Atkinson

5:49pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Igiveinthen says...

CaroleBaines wrote:
Bit of strong headline - labelling people as 'drunks' helps nobody, surely?
But surely that is exactly what they are isn't it?, they have gone out and drunk themselves into a stupor, aided and abetted by their friends, so to me the label 'Drunks' describes them perfectly.
[quote][p][bold]CaroleBaines[/bold] wrote: Bit of strong headline - labelling people as 'drunks' helps nobody, surely?[/p][/quote]But surely that is exactly what they are isn't it?, they have gone out and drunk themselves into a stupor, aided and abetted by their friends, so to me the label 'Drunks' describes them perfectly. Igiveinthen

5:55pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Igiveinthen says...

Zetkin wrote:
Quite right Wolf

If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke.

There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air.

What a load of cobblers.

The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.
What's that got to do with the original thread of the article? We're talking about excess alcohol consumption not whether they cycle or drive a car, don't go off at a tangent and open that can of worms.
[quote][p][bold]Zetkin[/bold] wrote: Quite right Wolf If I were in charge of picking and choosing, I might choose to charge people who have brought ill-health upon themselves through choosing to drive a car instead of walking or cycling. They'll probably be carrying more body fat, and have weaker hearts due to their wilful refusal to excercise, so should be made to pay when they're admitted to hospital with a heart attack or stroke. There should also be a surcharge to cover the cost of respiratory disease they've inflicted upon other people through pumping their noxious fumes in to the air. What a load of cobblers. The present government has been doing its utmost to bring the NHS crashing down - suggesting that it should charge on the basis of culbability for one's own ill health is just one more outsourced nail in the privatised coffin.[/p][/quote]What's that got to do with the original thread of the article? We're talking about excess alcohol consumption not whether they cycle or drive a car, don't go off at a tangent and open that can of worms. Igiveinthen

6:21pm Mon 17 Feb 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

Big Bad Wolf wrote:
YOUWILLDOASISAY wrote:
Should they be charged for the service ?.

Probably not.

Should they be educated like speeding drivers, probably yes.

Make them watch video of their situation and maybe 2 nights with the street angels seeing and dealing directly with the kind of situation they caused.
This would cost even more money...

AND how would you force them to watch the video? There are far worst things going on...

I am in no way condoning their behaviour simply pointing out that there is no way of changing it short of having the police arrest them for drunkenness and fining through the courts.
Really depends on the cost being seen as an expense or investment in changing behaviour, which results in longer term savings.

Do nothing, it stays the same.

Educate and for many you will have the opportunity to facilitate a change.

The problem seems to require more than a bed for the night or a fine.
[quote][p][bold]Big Bad Wolf[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]YOUWILLDOASISAY[/bold] wrote: Should they be charged for the service ?. Probably not. Should they be educated like speeding drivers, probably yes. Make them watch video of their situation and maybe 2 nights with the street angels seeing and dealing directly with the kind of situation they caused.[/p][/quote]This would cost even more money... AND how would you force them to watch the video? There are far worst things going on... I am in no way condoning their behaviour simply pointing out that there is no way of changing it short of having the police arrest them for drunkenness and fining through the courts.[/p][/quote]Really depends on the cost being seen as an expense or investment in changing behaviour, which results in longer term savings. Do nothing, it stays the same. Educate and for many you will have the opportunity to facilitate a change. The problem seems to require more than a bed for the night or a fine. YOUWILLDOASISAY

6:58pm Mon 17 Feb 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

Clearly someone disagrees, both my comments multiple marked down in seconds.

What a surprise, but interesting, do hope you enjoyed that, do this one as well, won't change the message.
Clearly someone disagrees, both my comments multiple marked down in seconds. What a surprise, but interesting, do hope you enjoyed that, do this one as well, won't change the message. YOUWILLDOASISAY

8:00pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Buzzz Light-year says...

Zetkin and Big Bad Wolf make good points.

Despite the attempts to run it down, the NHS remit simply put is this: it meets the needs of everyone, it's free at the point of delivery and it's based on clinical need, not ability to pay.

The idea that people should pay *depending on what they did in the first place to need care* is inhuman and I only hope that those championing such a notion are totally brainwashed and incapable of affecting the system. Or the current government.... :-(

Also YOUWILLDOASISAY's idea of education is good. Prevention is definitely better than cure.
Zetkin and Big Bad Wolf make good points. Despite the attempts to run it down, the NHS remit simply put is this: it meets the needs of everyone, it's free at the point of delivery and it's based on clinical need, not ability to pay. The idea that people should pay *depending on what they did in the first place to need care* is inhuman and I only hope that those championing such a notion are totally brainwashed and incapable of affecting the system. Or the current government.... :-( Also YOUWILLDOASISAY's idea of education is good. Prevention is definitely better than cure. Buzzz Light-year

4:08am Tue 18 Feb 14

Magicman! says...

Will those who use the service be charged for it? and it be compulsory for them to use it or have a fine issued to them by the police for being drunk and disorderly if they don't go?
I don't see why, in times of austerity, the NHS, funded by everybody, should have to pay out to look after a few completely irresponsible and reckless individuals who get drunk and think that somehow they'll just be looked after for free.

I'm not saying this centre shouldn't go ahead, I AM saying that people who are referred there should be charged for using it, or fined if they don't but are clearly unable to look after themselves due to intoxication.
Will those who use the service be charged for it? and it be compulsory for them to use it or have a fine issued to them by the police for being drunk and disorderly if they don't go? I don't see why, in times of austerity, the NHS, funded by everybody, should have to pay out to look after a few completely irresponsible and reckless individuals who get drunk and think that somehow they'll just be looked after for free. I'm not saying this centre shouldn't go ahead, I AM saying that people who are referred there should be charged for using it, or fined if they don't but are clearly unable to look after themselves due to intoxication. Magicman!

10:13am Tue 18 Feb 14

hikerman says...

I thought if u was drunk the police arrested you locked you up for the night in court next day then charged for being drunk
I thought if u was drunk the police arrested you locked you up for the night in court next day then charged for being drunk hikerman

12:41pm Tue 18 Feb 14

Loollah says...

Archiebold the 1st wrote:
Loollah wrote:
Whilst it is a good idea to help ease the strain on A & E and Ambulance services, it may not encourage the more reckless few to take more responsability for their drinking! I'm sure there'll be a handful of people out there who will go out drinking to excess at the weekend, not worrying about taking care of themselves or getting home safely because they are safe in the knowledge that this service will pick them up, give them a bed for the night and rehydrate them.
i dont think anyone would go out with that frame of mind... "oh lets get wrecked tonight make a fool of myself so i can stay in a free bed"
Actually you'd be surprised. There are people out there who go out on the weekend with the intention of getting obliterated beyond belief and see nothing wrong with this pattern of behaviour! Just look at the whole Neknomination craze, a prime example of that kind of reckless "YOLO" attitude! Sadly that is what our society is coming to. It's the same reason you can't walk any of the main routes into town on a Friday/Saturday or Sunday morning without seeing piles of sick everywhere! The same reason that even the takeaways and McDonalds in the city centre need door staff at the weekend. It's not confined to York though, it's the same all over!
Whilst I'm not saying that people are going out with the "get wrecked tonight make a fool of myself so i can stay in a free bed" attitude, the reckless few in our society are going to be happily going out safe in the knowledge that they can get as obliterated as they want on drink and/or drugs and they don't need to take responsability for themselves because someone else will do it for them!
[quote][p][bold]Archiebold the 1st[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Loollah[/bold] wrote: Whilst it is a good idea to help ease the strain on A & E and Ambulance services, it may not encourage the more reckless few to take more responsability for their drinking! I'm sure there'll be a handful of people out there who will go out drinking to excess at the weekend, not worrying about taking care of themselves or getting home safely because they are safe in the knowledge that this service will pick them up, give them a bed for the night and rehydrate them.[/p][/quote]i dont think anyone would go out with that frame of mind... "oh lets get wrecked tonight make a fool of myself so i can stay in a free bed"[/p][/quote]Actually you'd be surprised. There are people out there who go out on the weekend with the intention of getting obliterated beyond belief and see nothing wrong with this pattern of behaviour! Just look at the whole Neknomination craze, a prime example of that kind of reckless "YOLO" attitude! Sadly that is what our society is coming to. It's the same reason you can't walk any of the main routes into town on a Friday/Saturday or Sunday morning without seeing piles of sick everywhere! The same reason that even the takeaways and McDonalds in the city centre need door staff at the weekend. It's not confined to York though, it's the same all over! Whilst I'm not saying that people are going out with the "get wrecked tonight make a fool of myself so i can stay in a free bed" attitude, the reckless few in our society are going to be happily going out safe in the knowledge that they can get as obliterated as they want on drink and/or drugs and they don't need to take responsability for themselves because someone else will do it for them! Loollah

12:51pm Tue 18 Feb 14

bolero says...

hikerman wrote:
I thought if u was drunk the police arrested you locked you up for the night in court next day then charged for being drunk
Too much paperwork involved.
[quote][p][bold]hikerman[/bold] wrote: I thought if u was drunk the police arrested you locked you up for the night in court next day then charged for being drunk[/p][/quote]Too much paperwork involved. bolero

5:30pm Tue 18 Feb 14

Diogenes2 says...

There is a place for drunkards in York.
In the police cells, and police vans.
There is a place for drunkards in York. In the police cells, and police vans. Diogenes2

12:43pm Wed 19 Feb 14

Sillybillies says...

Diogenes2 wrote:
There is a place for drunkards in York.
In the police cells, and police vans.
Correct, the drunk and disorderly should be arrested, held in police cells until sober then charged and bailed to the Magistrates, Court. A nice conviction for the CV works wonders. For those urinating in the street, a conviction for indecent exposure is even better.

Drunk and incapable is a more serious problem from a safely point of view, and needs a detoxification centre. Should not be a NHS problem, should be a police authority problem. Would encourage the police to deal with drunks properly.

Persistent drunk and disorderlies should be prosecuted, a few weeks in prison with the DTs thrown in is a real deterrent.
[quote][p][bold]Diogenes2[/bold] wrote: There is a place for drunkards in York. In the police cells, and police vans.[/p][/quote]Correct, the drunk and disorderly should be arrested, held in police cells until sober then charged and bailed to the Magistrates, Court. A nice conviction for the CV works wonders. For those urinating in the street, a conviction for indecent exposure is even better. Drunk and incapable is a more serious problem from a safely point of view, and needs a detoxification centre. Should not be a NHS problem, should be a police authority problem. Would encourage the police to deal with drunks properly. Persistent drunk and disorderlies should be prosecuted, a few weeks in prison with the DTs thrown in is a real deterrent. Sillybillies

1:36pm Thu 20 Feb 14

The Great Buda says...

Too all the people who scream "MAKE 'EM PAY"!!!!!!!!


They already do, its called "National Insurance".
Too all the people who scream "MAKE 'EM PAY"!!!!!!!! They already do, its called "National Insurance". The Great Buda

12:02pm Sun 23 Feb 14

alanyork says...

Great Buda get real half of the drunks are students and un-married mothers out on the lash with the sole purpose of gettin' off their ed's ! Thats why the tab should be picked up by the drunks after all they paid for thier drinks so let them pay for the after care when they are out of it. They caused it by being stupid so yes '' MAKE EM PAY '
Great Buda get real half of the drunks are students and un-married mothers out on the lash with the sole purpose of gettin' off their ed's ! Thats why the tab should be picked up by the drunks after all they paid for thier drinks so let them pay for the after care when they are out of it. They caused it by being stupid so yes '' MAKE EM PAY ' alanyork

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