Hauliers rocked by high fuel cost

Petrol and diesel prices are on the way up

Petrol and diesel prices are on the way up

First published in News
Last updated
York Press: Photograph of the Author by

A YORK-based haulier says rising fuel prices around the country have affected the industry “horrifically”.

The average price of a litre of unleaded petrol is currently 136.65p, just below the national average of 136.86p, but the price of a litre of diesel is 144.9, higher than the national average of 143.83p.

Paul Rhodes, director of A Rhodes Haulage in York, said the price increase was costing his company thousands of pounds per month.

He said: “It’s affecting us horrifically. It’s gone up 6p per litre since the beginning of the year. We use 60,000 litres per month, and 6p times that means we’re £3,600 per month worse off.

“We have to factor for it and we try to pass it on to customers where we can, but they suffer the same way, so at the end of the day, it comes off our bottom line.”

At current prices, a gallon of unleaded costs motorists an average of just over £6.21, while a gallon of diesel costs just under £6.59, and the constant increase in fuel prices has led some businesses, including Mr Rhodes’s, to look at alternatives to diesel.

He said: “We’re looking at everything from more efficient trucks to mixed fuel. We looked at LPG, exploring all availabilities and the network is getting bigger, but still we’re looking at the best price we can buy fuel at and what else is on the market.

“We have to make a living as well, like everyone else, and at the end of the day we have to look at any way we can to save. It’s tough for a lot of people out there. A lot of road hauliers are having it tough, and if we don’t look to make savings where we can, we feel the squeeze like everyone else.”

Campaigners have urged chancellor George Osborne to use next month’s budget to cancel a duty increase due later this year, and start to cut the amount of tax taken by the Government.

Mr Rhodes said: “A Government survey found we have one of the fairest systems. What people don’t realise is that the Government charges 81 per cent tax, and that makes the price as high as it is.

“Any excuse, whether it’s some kind of uprising in a Middle East country, they are very quick to go and put the price up but when it comes down, they are very slow to filter it back.

“Everyone is mocking the report but unfortunately I don’t see a way around it unless the Government changes the amount of tax they charge us. They say they have sympathy with us, but I don’t feel they do.”

Comments (21)

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9:31am Mon 25 Feb 13

peter123456 says...

Having my own transport business what worries me is that normally in a recession things normally get cheaper to stimulate the economy. With fuel prices as high as they are now what price are we going to pay when we finally do come out of recession. £2 per litre and more will be on the cards just you wait and see. This is not scare mongering this is the truth and no one seams to care. I do not think people realise the knock on effect that fuel prices are having in our lives.
Having my own transport business what worries me is that normally in a recession things normally get cheaper to stimulate the economy. With fuel prices as high as they are now what price are we going to pay when we finally do come out of recession. £2 per litre and more will be on the cards just you wait and see. This is not scare mongering this is the truth and no one seams to care. I do not think people realise the knock on effect that fuel prices are having in our lives. peter123456
  • Score: 0

9:47am Mon 25 Feb 13

Guy Fawkes says...

Most of the recent rise has been accounted for by the fall in the value of the pound, which makes Mark Carney's enthusiasm for more QE all the more worrying.

In the longer term, it is a warning shot to those who want to ignore reality, continue with government borrowing and spending as if there's no tomorrow and oppose any reduction in public expenditure as 'evil Tory cuts'. Even Pedalling Paul types who regard the private ownership and use of vehicles as fundamentally wrong will be affected, as they have to buy goods that have been transported by road and benefit from services provided by workers who need to travel by road in order to deliver them.
Most of the recent rise has been accounted for by the fall in the value of the pound, which makes Mark Carney's enthusiasm for more QE all the more worrying. In the longer term, it is a warning shot to those who want to ignore reality, continue with government borrowing and spending as if there's no tomorrow and oppose any reduction in public expenditure as 'evil Tory cuts'. Even Pedalling Paul types who regard the private ownership and use of vehicles as fundamentally wrong will be affected, as they have to buy goods that have been transported by road and benefit from services provided by workers who need to travel by road in order to deliver them. Guy Fawkes
  • Score: 0

10:26am Mon 25 Feb 13

asd says...

Strange that Guy Fawkes because this Goverment is STILL BORROWING and CUTTING services. Maybe if they cut VAT like previous gioverment did to 15% instead of raising it to 20 % it may stimulate business and cut fuel prices.
Strange that Guy Fawkes because this Goverment is STILL BORROWING and CUTTING services. Maybe if they cut VAT like previous gioverment did to 15% instead of raising it to 20 % it may stimulate business and cut fuel prices. asd
  • Score: 0

10:32am Mon 25 Feb 13

Guy Fawkes says...

Exactly. It's cutting services because we can't afford them. It's bottled out of cutting other services that we also can't afford, hence the continued borrowing. And if it reduced VAT, the result would simply be that we would spend more money on imported products (remember - VAT is not charged on essentials such as food, a lot of which is produced in Britain, but only on goods and services deemed to be discretionary, most of which come from abroad). That would be good news for the Chinese, but not us. Reducing petrol duty, on the other hand, would reduce the cost of everything, including services delivered by British workers. If and when the economy is in a good enough state to contemplate tax reductions, the priorities should be road fuel duty, council tax and then income tax, in that order. Reducing the tax on Chinese DVD players (VAT) should be near the bottom of the list.
Exactly. It's cutting services because we can't afford them. It's bottled out of cutting other services that we also can't afford, hence the continued borrowing. And if it reduced VAT, the result would simply be that we would spend more money on imported products (remember - VAT is not charged on essentials such as food, a lot of which is produced in Britain, but only on goods and services deemed to be discretionary, most of which come from abroad). That would be good news for the Chinese, but not us. Reducing petrol duty, on the other hand, would reduce the cost of everything, including services delivered by British workers. If and when the economy is in a good enough state to contemplate tax reductions, the priorities should be road fuel duty, council tax and then income tax, in that order. Reducing the tax on Chinese DVD players (VAT) should be near the bottom of the list. Guy Fawkes
  • Score: 0

10:43am Mon 25 Feb 13

NoNewsIsGoodNews says...

Removing VAT completely from anything produced in the UK could be good for industry and the economy.
Removing VAT completely from anything produced in the UK could be good for industry and the economy. NoNewsIsGoodNews
  • Score: 0

11:05am Mon 25 Feb 13

Capt. Dobie says...

"Maybe if they cut VAT like previous did to 15%..."

Maybe that's partly why they left us skint...

"Mr Rhodes said: “A Government survey found we have one of the fairest systems. What people don’t realise is that the Government charges 81 per cent tax, and that makes the price as high as it is."

It did publish that conclusion, but Oil Companies don't pass on cuts- as the tax is percentage based, higher fuel costs means more tax revenue, so if your job is to generate revenue via tax, why would you reduce that source of income.

I am not saying it is fair or proper, nor do I agree with the report as it all seems a bit cosy. When you have significant debt, even as an individual, you need to make cuts to pay the debt off.

History repeats: 1970s: Labour spends & borrows and puts the country in debt, becomes unpopular and looses election. 1980s: Tories cut and save to clear the debt, get us in the black, become unpopular because of cuts, late 1990s: Labour wins next election, spends and borrows and puts us in debt, early 21st century, Tories cut and save to clear the debt...etc, etc.
"Maybe if they cut VAT like previous [goverment] did to 15%..." Maybe that's partly why they left us skint... "Mr Rhodes said: “A Government survey found we have one of the fairest systems. What people don’t realise is that the Government charges 81 per cent tax, and that makes the price as high as it is." It did publish that conclusion, but Oil Companies don't pass on cuts- as the tax is percentage based, higher fuel costs means more tax revenue, so if your job is to generate revenue via tax, why would you reduce that source of income. I am not saying it is fair or proper, nor do I agree with the report as it all seems a bit cosy. When you have significant debt, even as an individual, you need to make cuts to pay the debt off. History repeats: 1970s: Labour spends & borrows and puts the country in debt, becomes unpopular and looses election. 1980s: Tories cut and save to clear the debt, get us in the black, become unpopular because of cuts, late 1990s: Labour wins next election, spends and borrows and puts us in debt, early 21st century, Tories cut and save to clear the debt...etc, etc. Capt. Dobie
  • Score: 0

11:52am Mon 25 Feb 13

yorkborn66 says...

My thoughts on boosting our economy are:

Severely reduce tax revenue on fuel to BRITISH haulage businesses.
Impose Tax to foreign haulers using our roads for free, and foreign haulers charged a levy on their cheap fuel on entering the UK.
Impose a high import tax on foreign goods.
All British goods (raw materials, manufacture, transportation and point of sale VAT free for at least 3 years, to generate growth.
Tax breaks to British owed companies and businesses wishing to set up business within the UK, paying tax to our government and not having the ability to dodge paying tax.
Is it not about time we had manufacturing back in the UK, we have the skills.
Instead of been a glorified service industry.
My thoughts on boosting our economy are: Severely reduce tax revenue on fuel to BRITISH haulage businesses. Impose Tax to foreign haulers using our roads for free, and foreign haulers charged a levy on their cheap fuel on entering the UK. Impose a high import tax on foreign goods. All British goods (raw materials, manufacture, transportation and point of sale VAT free for at least 3 years, to generate growth. Tax breaks to British owed companies and businesses wishing to set up business within the UK, paying tax to our government and not having the ability to dodge paying tax. Is it not about time we had manufacturing back in the UK, we have the skills. Instead of been a glorified service industry. yorkborn66
  • Score: 0

11:57am Mon 25 Feb 13

yorkborn66 says...

I meant owned not owed!
I meant owned not owed! yorkborn66
  • Score: 0

11:57am Mon 25 Feb 13

Garrowby Turnoff says...

We're not the most expensive place in Europe either. The honour goes to Norway at £1.64.

After deducting income tax Britain's spend 10% of their disposable income on petrol. The Greeks spend 25%, Turks 35%, and Eriteans 61%!

Take the tax off petrol and the country would collapse financially, much like Greece.

http://bit.ly/Hsywr5
We're not the most expensive place in Europe either. The honour goes to Norway at £1.64. After deducting income tax Britain's spend 10% of their disposable income on petrol. The Greeks spend 25%, Turks 35%, and Eriteans 61%! Take the tax off petrol and the country would collapse financially, much like Greece. http://bit.ly/Hsywr5 Garrowby Turnoff
  • Score: 0

11:58am Mon 25 Feb 13

emen says...

"Mr Rhodes said: “A Government survey found we have one of the fairest systems. What people don’t realise is that the Government charges 81 per cent tax, and that makes the price as high as it is."

The Government don't charge 81% tax. It's nearer 61% and if you can reclaim the VAT element it drops down around 42%.

Today's problems are more down to rising oil prices coupled to a falling pound and with the new Governor of the Bank of England and members of the government seemingly happy to talk sterling down further I expect we'll be seeing many more increases in fuel prices over the coming months.
"Mr Rhodes said: “A Government survey found we have one of the fairest systems. What people don’t realise is that the Government charges 81 per cent tax, and that makes the price as high as it is." The Government don't charge 81% tax. It's nearer 61% and if you can reclaim the VAT element it drops down around 42%. Today's problems are more down to rising oil prices coupled to a falling pound and with the new Governor of the Bank of England and members of the government seemingly happy to talk sterling down further I expect we'll be seeing many more increases in fuel prices over the coming months. emen
  • Score: 0

12:08pm Mon 25 Feb 13

ReginaldBiscuit says...

Guy Fawkes wrote:
Most of the recent rise has been accounted for by the fall in the value of the pound, which makes Mark Carney's enthusiasm for more QE all the more worrying.

In the longer term, it is a warning shot to those who want to ignore reality, continue with government borrowing and spending as if there's no tomorrow and oppose any reduction in public expenditure as 'evil Tory cuts'. Even Pedalling Paul types who regard the private ownership and use of vehicles as fundamentally wrong will be affected, as they have to buy goods that have been transported by road and benefit from services provided by workers who need to travel by road in order to deliver them.
QE doesn't work and I love your choice of words - 'ignore reality'. Pretty much what companies and governments in overvalued overhyped Britain have been doing for years. The economic woes that started in 2008 still continue and will not be solved soon unless the government takes radical Greek style austerity action. Given that the UK is the most indebted nation on earth, unless it does something to address the debt, world banks will force the issue hence the shot over the triple AAA bough. It's as simple as that. The government instead of kicking the poor should do something about the banks and large corporations and tax them properly. The politicians won't though because they are afraid of the banks and many in parliament have non-executive seats on the boards of large corporations. Who controls who? And has any banker really paid the price yet for bringing this country down? No. A few high profile heads have been pensioned off on 7-figure pensions. The poor darlings. The banks still continue to operate unchallenged and still unregulated which points to another fall at some point in the future.


Anyway, as a member of the Green Party, my own opinion is that fuel prices should be much higher because cars and lorries are a major source of pollution. Those with the bigger engines - Chelsea Tractors, big trucks - should pay more. I'd prefer to see more haulage transferred on the railway and significant investment in the rail network. There's nothing stopping private hauliers transferring their business to the railways either IF the services are there. Trouble is, it simply isn't going to happen unless either forced to by economic or global warming events.

Petrol prices are rigged as it stands. Firstly by the wholesale distributers which sit in front of the refineries and secondly by the government which taxes petrol and see fuel as a major source of income for the treasury. If you really want to send a message to the government about petrol prices, you need to take direct action and disrupt the country. Slow drives by groups of vehicles on the motorways etc. The government doesn't listen to the people anymore, it tends to go ahead and does what it likes.
[quote][p][bold]Guy Fawkes[/bold] wrote: Most of the recent rise has been accounted for by the fall in the value of the pound, which makes Mark Carney's enthusiasm for more QE all the more worrying. In the longer term, it is a warning shot to those who want to ignore reality, continue with government borrowing and spending as if there's no tomorrow and oppose any reduction in public expenditure as 'evil Tory cuts'. Even Pedalling Paul types who regard the private ownership and use of vehicles as fundamentally wrong will be affected, as they have to buy goods that have been transported by road and benefit from services provided by workers who need to travel by road in order to deliver them.[/p][/quote]QE doesn't work and I love your choice of words - 'ignore reality'. Pretty much what companies and governments in overvalued overhyped Britain have been doing for years. The economic woes that started in 2008 still continue and will not be solved soon unless the government takes radical Greek style austerity action. Given that the UK is the most indebted nation on earth, unless it does something to address the debt, world banks will force the issue hence the shot over the triple AAA bough. It's as simple as that. The government instead of kicking the poor should do something about the banks and large corporations and tax them properly. The politicians won't though because they are afraid of the banks and many in parliament have non-executive seats on the boards of large corporations. Who controls who? And has any banker really paid the price yet for bringing this country down? No. A few high profile heads have been pensioned off on 7-figure pensions. The poor darlings. The banks still continue to operate unchallenged and still unregulated which points to another fall at some point in the future. Anyway, as a member of the Green Party, my own opinion is that fuel prices should be much higher because cars and lorries are a major source of pollution. Those with the bigger engines - Chelsea Tractors, big trucks - should pay more. I'd prefer to see more haulage transferred on the railway and significant investment in the rail network. There's nothing stopping private hauliers transferring their business to the railways either IF the services are there. Trouble is, it simply isn't going to happen unless either forced to by economic or global warming events. Petrol prices are rigged as it stands. Firstly by the wholesale distributers which sit in front of the refineries and secondly by the government which taxes petrol and see fuel as a major source of income for the treasury. If you really want to send a message to the government about petrol prices, you need to take direct action and disrupt the country. Slow drives by groups of vehicles on the motorways etc. The government doesn't listen to the people anymore, it tends to go ahead and does what it likes. ReginaldBiscuit
  • Score: 0

1:28pm Mon 25 Feb 13

yorkborn66 says...

Wouldn’t it be better for the economy if fuel duty were dramatically reduced for HGV’S? We need HGV’S, as there are our only sources of distribution of goods.
The savings can then be past on to the end user and I hope not the supermarkets and retailers profits.
The railways would not be a viable option as you have said. Also you would need a HGV at each end to transport the goods locally.
I do not think the government will take seriously a national transportation system that will reduce private car journeys. It would be self defeating to them as they get to much revenue from fuel duty and VAT.
Wouldn’t it be better for the economy if fuel duty were dramatically reduced for HGV’S? We need HGV’S, as there are our only sources of distribution of goods. The savings can then be past on to the end user and I hope not the supermarkets and retailers profits. The railways would not be a viable option as you have said. Also you would need a HGV at each end to transport the goods locally. I do not think the government will take seriously a national transportation system that will reduce private car journeys. It would be self defeating to them as they get to much revenue from fuel duty and VAT. yorkborn66
  • Score: 0

1:29pm Mon 25 Feb 13

yorkborn66 says...

ReginaldBiscuit wrote:
Guy Fawkes wrote:
Most of the recent rise has been accounted for by the fall in the value of the pound, which makes Mark Carney's enthusiasm for more QE all the more worrying.

In the longer term, it is a warning shot to those who want to ignore reality, continue with government borrowing and spending as if there's no tomorrow and oppose any reduction in public expenditure as 'evil Tory cuts'. Even Pedalling Paul types who regard the private ownership and use of vehicles as fundamentally wrong will be affected, as they have to buy goods that have been transported by road and benefit from services provided by workers who need to travel by road in order to deliver them.
QE doesn't work and I love your choice of words - 'ignore reality'. Pretty much what companies and governments in overvalued overhyped Britain have been doing for years. The economic woes that started in 2008 still continue and will not be solved soon unless the government takes radical Greek style austerity action. Given that the UK is the most indebted nation on earth, unless it does something to address the debt, world banks will force the issue hence the shot over the triple AAA bough. It's as simple as that. The government instead of kicking the poor should do something about the banks and large corporations and tax them properly. The politicians won't though because they are afraid of the banks and many in parliament have non-executive seats on the boards of large corporations. Who controls who? And has any banker really paid the price yet for bringing this country down? No. A few high profile heads have been pensioned off on 7-figure pensions. The poor darlings. The banks still continue to operate unchallenged and still unregulated which points to another fall at some point in the future.


Anyway, as a member of the Green Party, my own opinion is that fuel prices should be much higher because cars and lorries are a major source of pollution. Those with the bigger engines - Chelsea Tractors, big trucks - should pay more. I'd prefer to see more haulage transferred on the railway and significant investment in the rail network. There's nothing stopping private hauliers transferring their business to the railways either IF the services are there. Trouble is, it simply isn't going to happen unless either forced to by economic or global warming events.

Petrol prices are rigged as it stands. Firstly by the wholesale distributers which sit in front of the refineries and secondly by the government which taxes petrol and see fuel as a major source of income for the treasury. If you really want to send a message to the government about petrol prices, you need to take direct action and disrupt the country. Slow drives by groups of vehicles on the motorways etc. The government doesn't listen to the people anymore, it tends to go ahead and does what it likes.
Wouldn’t it be better for the economy if fuel duty were dramatically reduced for HGV’S? We need HGV’S, as there are our only sources of distribution of goods.
The savings can then be past on to the end user and I hope not the supermarkets and retailers profits.
The railways would not be a viable option as you have said. Also you would need a HGV at each end to transport the goods locally.
I do not think the government will take seriously a national transportation system that will reduce private car journeys. It would be self defeating to them as they get to much revenue from fuel duty and VAT.
[quote][p][bold]ReginaldBiscuit[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Guy Fawkes[/bold] wrote: Most of the recent rise has been accounted for by the fall in the value of the pound, which makes Mark Carney's enthusiasm for more QE all the more worrying. In the longer term, it is a warning shot to those who want to ignore reality, continue with government borrowing and spending as if there's no tomorrow and oppose any reduction in public expenditure as 'evil Tory cuts'. Even Pedalling Paul types who regard the private ownership and use of vehicles as fundamentally wrong will be affected, as they have to buy goods that have been transported by road and benefit from services provided by workers who need to travel by road in order to deliver them.[/p][/quote]QE doesn't work and I love your choice of words - 'ignore reality'. Pretty much what companies and governments in overvalued overhyped Britain have been doing for years. The economic woes that started in 2008 still continue and will not be solved soon unless the government takes radical Greek style austerity action. Given that the UK is the most indebted nation on earth, unless it does something to address the debt, world banks will force the issue hence the shot over the triple AAA bough. It's as simple as that. The government instead of kicking the poor should do something about the banks and large corporations and tax them properly. The politicians won't though because they are afraid of the banks and many in parliament have non-executive seats on the boards of large corporations. Who controls who? And has any banker really paid the price yet for bringing this country down? No. A few high profile heads have been pensioned off on 7-figure pensions. The poor darlings. The banks still continue to operate unchallenged and still unregulated which points to another fall at some point in the future. Anyway, as a member of the Green Party, my own opinion is that fuel prices should be much higher because cars and lorries are a major source of pollution. Those with the bigger engines - Chelsea Tractors, big trucks - should pay more. I'd prefer to see more haulage transferred on the railway and significant investment in the rail network. There's nothing stopping private hauliers transferring their business to the railways either IF the services are there. Trouble is, it simply isn't going to happen unless either forced to by economic or global warming events. Petrol prices are rigged as it stands. Firstly by the wholesale distributers which sit in front of the refineries and secondly by the government which taxes petrol and see fuel as a major source of income for the treasury. If you really want to send a message to the government about petrol prices, you need to take direct action and disrupt the country. Slow drives by groups of vehicles on the motorways etc. The government doesn't listen to the people anymore, it tends to go ahead and does what it likes.[/p][/quote]Wouldn’t it be better for the economy if fuel duty were dramatically reduced for HGV’S? We need HGV’S, as there are our only sources of distribution of goods. The savings can then be past on to the end user and I hope not the supermarkets and retailers profits. The railways would not be a viable option as you have said. Also you would need a HGV at each end to transport the goods locally. I do not think the government will take seriously a national transportation system that will reduce private car journeys. It would be self defeating to them as they get to much revenue from fuel duty and VAT. yorkborn66
  • Score: 0

1:52pm Mon 25 Feb 13

Whistlejacket says...

@ReginaldBiscuit..
You seem a bit confused, even for a Green. First you suggest that fuel prices should be higher, then you suggest that we should all take direct action to force the government to lower prices.
You suggest that "Chelsea tractors" should pay more. They already do: If you drive a vehicle that does fewer miles/gallon then you pay more to get to your destination. Large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty.
Petrol prices are not "rigged" by wholesalers. The largest players in the road fuel market are the supermarkets. They can and do buy directly from any refinery they wish. Wholesalers are only really signicant players in the domestic heating / agricultural fuel sector.
@ReginaldBiscuit.. You seem a bit confused, even for a Green. First you suggest that fuel prices should be higher, then you suggest that we should all take direct action to force the government to lower prices. You suggest that "Chelsea tractors" should pay more. They already do: If you drive a vehicle that does fewer miles/gallon then you pay more to get to your destination. Large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty. Petrol prices are not "rigged" by wholesalers. The largest players in the road fuel market are the supermarkets. They can and do buy directly from any refinery they wish. Wholesalers are only really signicant players in the domestic heating / agricultural fuel sector. Whistlejacket
  • Score: 0

2:43pm Mon 25 Feb 13

Kevin Turvey says...

‘ReginaldBiscuit says... 12:08pm Mon 25 Feb 13
If you really want to send a message to the government about petrol prices, you need to take direct action and disrupt the country. ‘


Yes Direct action is good but slow drives are not the answer!

What is the answer is not buying fuel, going to work or buying anything that attracts VAT for two weeks or longer.

That sends a message to the treasury and the government!

Stop their cash flow.

No income tax, National Insurance, fuel duty or VAT for two weeks or longer!

That will make the government think about reducing the tax burden on fuel to a lower level and indeed lower VAT generally.

Better for the government to have a little bit less of a lot that nothing at all!

However, getting all the population to do that is impossible and the government and big business know that, hence why we get shafted as a population by our own public servants, the people working for us!

End result is that we ALL pay far too much for fuel (and the effects) because of the crippling effect of the taxation levied!

When I was in Canada last year the Canadians did not believe how much our fuel was and theirs is very expensive compared to the USA!
‘ReginaldBiscuit says... 12:08pm Mon 25 Feb 13 If you really want to send a message to the government about petrol prices, you need to take direct action and disrupt the country. ‘ Yes Direct action is good but slow drives are not the answer! What is the answer is not buying fuel, going to work or buying anything that attracts VAT for two weeks or longer. That sends a message to the treasury and the government! Stop their cash flow. No income tax, National Insurance, fuel duty or VAT for two weeks or longer! That will make the government think about reducing the tax burden on fuel to a lower level and indeed lower VAT generally. Better for the government to have a little bit less of a lot that nothing at all! However, getting all the population to do that is impossible and the government and big business know that, hence why we get shafted as a population by our own public servants, the people working for us! End result is that we ALL pay far too much for fuel (and the effects) because of the crippling effect of the taxation levied! When I was in Canada last year the Canadians did not believe how much our fuel was and theirs is very expensive compared to the USA! Kevin Turvey
  • Score: 0

5:10pm Mon 25 Feb 13

Garrowby Turnoff says...

George Osborne's tax breaks for the Oil companies has resulted in increased investment in our own oil fields. Billions more investment in the search for new wells will mean prosperity and jobs for over 200,000 Scots. There'll be £25 billion more tax for the UK due to this. You would hope such prosperity (announced today) will result in a reduction of the tax take from pump prices, but I doubt it.

Revenue from oil is the backbone of world economy. So much so, that if someone discovered an alternative new energy source he'd have to be shot! And not just by the Arabs!
George Osborne's tax breaks for the Oil companies has resulted in increased investment in our own oil fields. Billions more investment in the search for new wells will mean prosperity and jobs for over 200,000 Scots. There'll be £25 billion more tax for the UK due to this. You would hope such prosperity (announced today) will result in a reduction of the tax take from pump prices, but I doubt it. Revenue from oil is the backbone of world economy. So much so, that if someone discovered an alternative new energy source he'd have to be shot! And not just by the Arabs! Garrowby Turnoff
  • Score: 0

7:16pm Mon 25 Feb 13

ReginaldBiscuit says...

Whistlejacket wrote:
@ReginaldBiscuit..
You seem a bit confused, even for a Green. First you suggest that fuel prices should be higher, then you suggest that we should all take direct action to force the government to lower prices.
You suggest that "Chelsea tractors" should pay more. They already do: If you drive a vehicle that does fewer miles/gallon then you pay more to get to your destination. Large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty.
Petrol prices are not "rigged" by wholesalers. The largest players in the road fuel market are the supermarkets. They can and do buy directly from any refinery they wish. Wholesalers are only really signicant players in the domestic heating / agricultural fuel sector.
@Whistlejacket

Perhaps you're the one who is a little confused? Fuel prices should be higher - Yes. The bit about taking action if you're grumpy about fuel prices is in separate paragraph because it's an action point for you car drivers although not necessarily one I would condone. I merely made a point about our political masters and was referencing the context of the original story.

Chelsea Tractors - Shove an extra £2000 pounds on the road tax. If you can afford one, you can afford the extra £2000. I'd also super road tax the high performance cars of football players and other wealthy people. They can afford it quite easily.

Yes, I know large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty - it should be even higher but that's only my opinion.

If you can be bothered, read this story from Dacre's rag - http://www.dailymail
.co.uk/news/article-
2270728/Whitewash-st
orm-watchdog-rules-p
etrol-price-inquiry-
evidence-drivers-rip
ped-off.html

and then read this Spectator Blog - http://blogs.spectat
or.co.uk/coffeehouse
/2012/09/how-oil-com
panies-could-be-infl
ating-petrol-prices/


There are other similar stories dotted round various news portals and I stand by what I think and wrote. Fuel prices are rigged.

@Kevin Turvey - Fair point Kev.

@yorkborn66 - consumable net imports into the UK are simply staggering. We don't need to import half the food and drink that we do. Again, a personal opinion but I would rather see local fresh produce in supermarkets. The buzz word 'choice' that I loathe brings with it massive overheads. Yes, I'd love to see freight back onto rail as much as possible and reinvestment in the rail network at the expense of choice and pollution but as said, I doubt it will happen unless economics or global warming has a severe impact.
[quote][p][bold]Whistlejacket[/bold] wrote: @ReginaldBiscuit.. You seem a bit confused, even for a Green. First you suggest that fuel prices should be higher, then you suggest that we should all take direct action to force the government to lower prices. You suggest that "Chelsea tractors" should pay more. They already do: If you drive a vehicle that does fewer miles/gallon then you pay more to get to your destination. Large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty. Petrol prices are not "rigged" by wholesalers. The largest players in the road fuel market are the supermarkets. They can and do buy directly from any refinery they wish. Wholesalers are only really signicant players in the domestic heating / agricultural fuel sector.[/p][/quote]@Whistlejacket Perhaps you're the one who is a little confused? Fuel prices should be higher - Yes. The bit about taking action if you're grumpy about fuel prices is in separate paragraph because it's an action point for you car drivers although not necessarily one I would condone. I merely made a point about our political masters and was referencing the context of the original story. Chelsea Tractors - Shove an extra £2000 pounds on the road tax. If you can afford one, you can afford the extra £2000. I'd also super road tax the high performance cars of football players and other wealthy people. They can afford it quite easily. Yes, I know large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty - it should be even higher but that's only my opinion. If you can be bothered, read this story from Dacre's rag - http://www.dailymail .co.uk/news/article- 2270728/Whitewash-st orm-watchdog-rules-p etrol-price-inquiry- evidence-drivers-rip ped-off.html and then read this Spectator Blog - http://blogs.spectat or.co.uk/coffeehouse /2012/09/how-oil-com panies-could-be-infl ating-petrol-prices/ There are other similar stories dotted round various news portals and I stand by what I think and wrote. Fuel prices are rigged. @Kevin Turvey - Fair point Kev. @yorkborn66 - consumable net imports into the UK are simply staggering. We don't need to import half the food and drink that we do. Again, a personal opinion but I would rather see local fresh produce in supermarkets. The buzz word 'choice' that I loathe brings with it massive overheads. Yes, I'd love to see freight back onto rail as much as possible and reinvestment in the rail network at the expense of choice and pollution but as said, I doubt it will happen unless economics or global warming has a severe impact. ReginaldBiscuit
  • Score: 0

7:45pm Mon 25 Feb 13

Guy Fawkes says...

Severely reduce tax revenue on fuel to BRITISH haulage businesses.
Impose Tax to foreign haulers using our roads for free, and foreign haulers charged a levy on their cheap fuel on entering the UK.
Impose a high import tax on foreign goods.
All British goods (raw materials, manufacture, transportation and point of sale VAT free for at least 3 years, to generate growth.
Tax breaks to British owed companies and businesses wishing to set up business within the UK, paying tax to our government and not having the ability to dodge paying tax.


We would not be allowed to do any of that unless we left the EU. Every single one of those proposals fall foul of European single market rules.

For the same reason, there is nothing we can do to stop Amazon trading in this country from a base in The Netherlands, or to stop Starbucks in the UK paying its Lithuanian subsidiary £150 for each packet of coffee beans (intra-EU sales cannot be taxed, which enables multinational corporations to move money around the EU tax-free though internal purchases), so that it can record a loss on its operations in high-tax EU member countries and book the profit in the low-tax ones. The only way we could ever be able to do something about it is either to lower the overall tax burden we place on companies to below that of all other EU member states, or leave the EU.

When I was in Canada last year the Canadians did not believe how much our fuel was and theirs is very expensive compared to the USA!


True, but what these comparisons don't take into account is that cars in North America are, generally speaking, a lot less fuel efficient. Also, the fuel itself has a lower energy content (typically 87-91 RON there, compared to 95-97 in Europe) and engines are lower compression. And they almost all have automatic transmission, which lowers efficiency even further. I drive quite a bit in the US and reckon that in terms of pennies spent per mile driven, the fuel cost there is roughly the same as it is here. The quantity of liquid burnt isn't, though.
[quote]Severely reduce tax revenue on fuel to BRITISH haulage businesses. Impose Tax to foreign haulers using our roads for free, and foreign haulers charged a levy on their cheap fuel on entering the UK. Impose a high import tax on foreign goods. All British goods (raw materials, manufacture, transportation and point of sale VAT free for at least 3 years, to generate growth. Tax breaks to British owed companies and businesses wishing to set up business within the UK, paying tax to our government and not having the ability to dodge paying tax.[/quote] We would not be allowed to do any of that unless we left the EU. Every single one of those proposals fall foul of European single market rules. For the same reason, there is nothing we can do to stop Amazon trading in this country from a base in The Netherlands, or to stop Starbucks in the UK paying its Lithuanian subsidiary £150 for each packet of coffee beans (intra-EU sales cannot be taxed, which enables multinational corporations to move money around the EU tax-free though internal purchases), so that it can record a loss on its operations in high-tax EU member countries and book the profit in the low-tax ones. The only way we could ever be able to do something about it is either to lower the overall tax burden we place on companies to below that of all other EU member states, or leave the EU. [quote]When I was in Canada last year the Canadians did not believe how much our fuel was and theirs is very expensive compared to the USA![/quote] True, but what these comparisons don't take into account is that cars in North America are, generally speaking, a lot less fuel efficient. Also, the fuel itself has a lower energy content (typically 87-91 RON there, compared to 95-97 in Europe) and engines are lower compression. And they almost all have automatic transmission, which lowers efficiency even further. I drive quite a bit in the US and reckon that in terms of pennies spent per mile driven, the fuel cost there is roughly the same as it is here. The quantity of liquid burnt isn't, though. Guy Fawkes
  • Score: 0

10:26pm Mon 25 Feb 13

yorkborn66 says...

ReginaldBiscuit wrote:
Whistlejacket wrote:
@ReginaldBiscuit..
You seem a bit confused, even for a Green. First you suggest that fuel prices should be higher, then you suggest that we should all take direct action to force the government to lower prices.
You suggest that "Chelsea tractors" should pay more. They already do: If you drive a vehicle that does fewer miles/gallon then you pay more to get to your destination. Large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty.
Petrol prices are not "rigged" by wholesalers. The largest players in the road fuel market are the supermarkets. They can and do buy directly from any refinery they wish. Wholesalers are only really signicant players in the domestic heating / agricultural fuel sector.
@Whistlejacket

Perhaps you're the one who is a little confused? Fuel prices should be higher - Yes. The bit about taking action if you're grumpy about fuel prices is in separate paragraph because it's an action point for you car drivers although not necessarily one I would condone. I merely made a point about our political masters and was referencing the context of the original story.

Chelsea Tractors - Shove an extra £2000 pounds on the road tax. If you can afford one, you can afford the extra £2000. I'd also super road tax the high performance cars of football players and other wealthy people. They can afford it quite easily.

Yes, I know large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty - it should be even higher but that's only my opinion.

If you can be bothered, read this story from Dacre's rag - http://www.dailymail

.co.uk/news/article-

2270728/Whitewash-st

orm-watchdog-rules-p

etrol-price-inquiry-

evidence-drivers-rip

ped-off.html

and then read this Spectator Blog - http://blogs.spectat

or.co.uk/coffeehouse

/2012/09/how-oil-com

panies-could-be-infl

ating-petrol-prices/



There are other similar stories dotted round various news portals and I stand by what I think and wrote. Fuel prices are rigged.

@Kevin Turvey - Fair point Kev.

@yorkborn66 - consumable net imports into the UK are simply staggering. We don't need to import half the food and drink that we do. Again, a personal opinion but I would rather see local fresh produce in supermarkets. The buzz word 'choice' that I loathe brings with it massive overheads. Yes, I'd love to see freight back onto rail as much as possible and reinvestment in the rail network at the expense of choice and pollution but as said, I doubt it will happen unless economics or global warming has a severe impact.
ReginaldBiscuit wrote:
@yorkborn66 - consumable net imports into the UK are simply staggering. We don't need to import half the food and drink that we do. Again, a personal opinion but I would rather see local fresh produce in supermarkets. The buzz word 'choice' that I loathe brings with it massive overheads. Yes, I'd love to see freight back onto rail as much as possible and reinvestment in the rail network at the expense of choice and pollution but as said, I doubt it will happen unless economics or global warming has a severe impact.

Totally agree with you on this, but our government has a hidden agenda only known to them. We would not have the problems with horsemeat if we could buy locally. The laws need changing regarding labelling produce. I wanted to buy British apples and found out I was buying French apples packaged in the UK, so the supermarket could place the British flag on them. Bl@@dy disgrace.
[quote][p][bold]ReginaldBiscuit[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Whistlejacket[/bold] wrote: @ReginaldBiscuit.. You seem a bit confused, even for a Green. First you suggest that fuel prices should be higher, then you suggest that we should all take direct action to force the government to lower prices. You suggest that "Chelsea tractors" should pay more. They already do: If you drive a vehicle that does fewer miles/gallon then you pay more to get to your destination. Large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty. Petrol prices are not "rigged" by wholesalers. The largest players in the road fuel market are the supermarkets. They can and do buy directly from any refinery they wish. Wholesalers are only really signicant players in the domestic heating / agricultural fuel sector.[/p][/quote]@Whistlejacket Perhaps you're the one who is a little confused? Fuel prices should be higher - Yes. The bit about taking action if you're grumpy about fuel prices is in separate paragraph because it's an action point for you car drivers although not necessarily one I would condone. I merely made a point about our political masters and was referencing the context of the original story. Chelsea Tractors - Shove an extra £2000 pounds on the road tax. If you can afford one, you can afford the extra £2000. I'd also super road tax the high performance cars of football players and other wealthy people. They can afford it quite easily. Yes, I know large vehicles also pay a higher vehicle excise duty - it should be even higher but that's only my opinion. If you can be bothered, read this story from Dacre's rag - http://www.dailymail .co.uk/news/article- 2270728/Whitewash-st orm-watchdog-rules-p etrol-price-inquiry- evidence-drivers-rip ped-off.html and then read this Spectator Blog - http://blogs.spectat or.co.uk/coffeehouse /2012/09/how-oil-com panies-could-be-infl ating-petrol-prices/ There are other similar stories dotted round various news portals and I stand by what I think and wrote. Fuel prices are rigged. @Kevin Turvey - Fair point Kev. @yorkborn66 - consumable net imports into the UK are simply staggering. We don't need to import half the food and drink that we do. Again, a personal opinion but I would rather see local fresh produce in supermarkets. The buzz word 'choice' that I loathe brings with it massive overheads. Yes, I'd love to see freight back onto rail as much as possible and reinvestment in the rail network at the expense of choice and pollution but as said, I doubt it will happen unless economics or global warming has a severe impact.[/p][/quote]ReginaldBiscuit wrote: @yorkborn66 - consumable net imports into the UK are simply staggering. We don't need to import half the food and drink that we do. Again, a personal opinion but I would rather see local fresh produce in supermarkets. The buzz word 'choice' that I loathe brings with it massive overheads. Yes, I'd love to see freight back onto rail as much as possible and reinvestment in the rail network at the expense of choice and pollution but as said, I doubt it will happen unless economics or global warming has a severe impact. Totally agree with you on this, but our government has a hidden agenda only known to them. We would not have the problems with horsemeat if we could buy locally. The laws need changing regarding labelling produce. I wanted to buy British apples and found out I was buying French apples packaged in the UK, so the supermarket could place the British flag on them. Bl@@dy disgrace. yorkborn66
  • Score: 0

11:37pm Mon 25 Feb 13

bob the builder says...

... if costs go up, you put your prices up, if everyone followed this rule of thumb, we'd all stay in business! This is where corporate tax avoiding global companies don't play by the gentlemanly rules of small business, undercut you, bankrupt you then raise their prices having dealt with the competition.
... if costs go up, you put your prices up, if everyone followed this rule of thumb, we'd all stay in business! This is where corporate tax avoiding global companies don't play by the gentlemanly rules of small business, undercut you, bankrupt you then raise their prices having dealt with the competition. bob the builder
  • Score: 0

9:48am Tue 26 Feb 13

yorkborn66 says...

bob the builder wrote:
... if costs go up, you put your prices up, if everyone followed this rule of thumb, we'd all stay in business! This is where corporate tax avoiding global companies don't play by the gentlemanly rules of small business, undercut you, bankrupt you then raise their prices having dealt with the competition.
That’s also assuming everyone pays tax, NI , and NO cash in hand work to undercut genuine tradespeolpe. Potential customers that accept this should be treated in the same way these con artists and benefit cheats would be if caught.
They hasn’t been a level playing field for years .
[quote][p][bold]bob the builder[/bold] wrote: ... if costs go up, you put your prices up, if everyone followed this rule of thumb, we'd all stay in business! This is where corporate tax avoiding global companies don't play by the gentlemanly rules of small business, undercut you, bankrupt you then raise their prices having dealt with the competition.[/p][/quote]That’s also assuming everyone pays tax, NI , and NO cash in hand work to undercut genuine tradespeolpe. Potential customers that accept this should be treated in the same way these con artists and benefit cheats would be if caught. They hasn’t been a level playing field for years . yorkborn66
  • Score: 0

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