Pothole repairs fall below standard as budget cuts start to bite (From York Press)
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Pothole repairs fall below standard as budget cuts start to bite
11:00am Wednesday 30th January 2013 in News
By Mark Stead, Political Reporter
Politicians have clashed over the standard of repairs to potholes
QUICK fixes and below-par repairs are being carried out on York roads after problems spiralled, council bosses have admitted.
City of York Council says the number of defects has left workers too stretched to mend them to the normal standard, forcing them to improvise.
The news emerged as council leader James Alexander warned many local authorities faced bankruptcy and said York was fighting to avoid such a crisis.
The authority cut £385,000 from road repair budgets this year and another £185,000 cut is planned for 2013/14, with £500,000 a year less than originally intended for resurfacing and reconstruction.
The Liberal Democrat group said these cuts – also criticised by a road safety organisation – were now “beginning to bite” after warnings were ignored.
The Press has seen email correspondence from the council’s highways infrastructure department in which officials say workers were left with no choice but to carry out temporary repairs over Christmas and New Year because tarmac plants were closed.
The department said pothole repairs were currently not being done to the normal standards because of “the large number of defects” across the city, but this would change once problems fell to a “manageable” level.
Lib Dem councillor Nigel Ayre highlighted a pothole in his Heworth Without ward which was recently fixed twice but crumbled again within days.
He said: “The lack of regular maintenance has led to a rapid deterioration in the state of the city’s roads.
“The number of defects which has accumulated is now so large that repairs are having to be carried out to inferior standards just to cope with the workload. It’s also unclear when the council will be able to revert to the usual standard. Repairing the same problem over and over is costing the city dearly, when it cannot afford it.”
Lib Dem group leader Coun Carol Runciman said road budget cuts were “typical of Labour’s short-sighted nature”.
Neil Greig, the Institute of Advanced Motorists’ director of policy and research, said recent cold weather had exacerbated “the poor state of our roads” and temporary repairs were “just a sticking plaster”.
“Simply working smarter is not enough, and by cutting budgets now, York is storing up higher bills for future council taxpayers,” he said.
Coun David Levene, cabinet member for environmental services, said Labour was “managing services responsibly” and the Lib Dems were “opportunistically distorting the truth” over road repairs.
He said: “They should be ashamed of themselves. The council is committed to acting responsively to problems when they arise. In this case, due to our regular contractors being unavailable at Christmas, a temporary solution was found.”
Roger Ranson, assistant director of city and environmental services, said all roads were regularly inspected and maintained to ensure they were safe and in good condition, and “emergency pothole repairs” were done in Heworth over Christmas and New Year.
“In situations like this, it’s standard practice to use approved cold lay materials,” he said.
“We follow national guidelines for the repair of potholes and try to respond as quickly as possible if we are alerted to a problem.”
Comments(45)
Bigwood
says...
11:13am Wed 30 Jan 13
yorkborn66
says...
11:21am Wed 30 Jan 13
One worker pours out cold tar from a bag and gives it a shovel finish.
It’s like using a sledge hammer to hammer in a small nail.
Within days the hole is there again.
The roads are a complete disgrace and a danger to road users.
If the money is not available to the council, I find it hard to criticize them.
IF our Government stopped spending money on wars (conflicts), now aiding the French.
And sending millions of pounds abroad, then maybe councils would receive adequate funding.
Hes123
says...
12:16pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Ignatius Lumpopo
says...
12:18pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Then, in later spring, it should fix them all properly.
roskoboskovic
says...
12:26pm Wed 30 Jan 13
JHardacre
says...
12:34pm Wed 30 Jan 13
I'll wager that it's probably less than their budget for legal expenses fighting such claims.
JHardacre
says...
12:34pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Ignatius Lumpopo wrote:Here Here!!
Little point in trying to fix them during all this mixed up weather. CoYC should draw a day-glo circle around them and put signs up telling road-users to put up with them until it's realistic to fix them.
Then, in later spring, it should fix them all properly.
BertieBrompton
says...
12:40pm Wed 30 Jan 13
BertieBrompton
says...
12:40pm Wed 30 Jan 13
bob the builder
says...
12:41pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Jam tomorrow
says...
12:46pm Wed 30 Jan 13
ColdAsChristmas
says...
12:50pm Wed 30 Jan 13
The ideal solution is resurfacing but as a minimum the pot holes need to be repaired properly and promptly. Repair to a poor standard and you will end up with the same problem soon after, not cost effective at all.
I found it rather strange that the Council claim to be fighting bankruptcy while not that long since suggesting Councillors allowances be hugely increased. What planet are they on?
The business of the local authority is to serve the public. As far as road condition and clearing footpaths during icy weather they have failed the public on the most basic safety standards.
soprano 2
says...
1:05pm Wed 30 Jan 13
DEKKA
says...
2:14pm Wed 30 Jan 13
roskoboskovic wrote:have you ever cycled in york?..if you did you would see that the cycle lanes are just as bad as the roads.
ycc under labour have no interest in sorting out roads for the motorists.as long as that strip along the nearside is fine they re not bothered and all the newly laid designated bike paths are in good nick.
uriahh
says...
2:31pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Delayed repairs and lack of ongoing inspection and repair of minor defects as and when they occur save money in the longer term. Any failure to do this leads to escalating impact damage from traffic enlarging any defect which will lead to an escalation of more water penetration under the road surface and foundation softening and further collapse of the road surface around the defect, ultimately exascerbated by frost damage and even larger and more defcts requiring repairs. i
"Cheap" low standard repairs after significant potholes have occured in will only lead to more damage which in turn will lead to even higher bills in the near future compared with repairs being carried out properly in the first place! In addition the likely compensation payments to motorists' insurers for tyre and suspension damage and even exhaust damage will become quite significant.
Garrowby Turnoff
says...
3:15pm Wed 30 Jan 13
BertieBrompton wrote:Try this website...
How do I claim for damages to my car due to poor road surfaces?
http://www.potholes.
co.uk/claims/how_to_
claim
ReginaldBiscuit
says...
3:25pm Wed 30 Jan 13
"Fantastic opportunity to be an integral part of the infrastructure (literally) of York.
Working with a highly prestigious (if you're a rotted cadaver), forward-looking (the arrow of time only goes one way) and dynamic IT focussed (they own a Blackberry) company.
Must possess strong customer facing skills (unless you lie face down in the pothole) and be enthusiastic about your work (you're a pothole, smile).
(Poverty) Salary: Just about enough to buy a bowl of rice whilst those above you drink champagne and suck off your inheritance whilst eating any living relatives you may have left."
If the tories could do this, THEY WOULD.
Viper_7
says...
3:38pm Wed 30 Jan 13
soprano 2 wrote:Indeed, do the job properly once and have it last.
It is a false economy to make a sub-standard repair - it will only have to be done again!
Surely spending a little more time on the repair is less time consuming and uses less resources then sending the teams out several times over. The repairers spend more time travelling about than actually repairing.
Also, give them some flexibility, if they repair a pothole on their schedule and there is another one 10 feet away- pigging fix that too! Really need to deal with this problem smartly.
Capt. Dobie
says...
3:46pm Wed 30 Jan 13
"If the tories could do this, THEY WOULD."
Really? Just the Tories? Oh doi be brief Reg...
Blair did alright didn't he..? He was purrrfect wasn't he...the same PM Blair who said 'oh God, not the soldiers wives as well? It's bad enough dealing with them...' when visiting Aldershot in the late 90s.
And Good Old Gordon Clown floggin' off our entire gold reserves for a pie and chips take out...then miring us and our children in debt for the next 50 yrs by getting loans left, right & centre to hand out to whoever. If you remember when CamClegg took over, the bloke who departed the treasury left a scribbled note saying 'it's all gone, there is nothing left.' on the Sec of States desk...short memory Reg?
Labour are far, far, far from perfect. Don't bash the tories because your parents did, bash the bloke making the decisions...
The country my friend, is skint.
BTW, anybody else thinks that Miliband looks 'Pit the Younger' from Blackadder III or one of the 'Banking Clan' from Start Wars Episode III?
ReginaldBiscuit
says...
4:40pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Capt. Dobie wrote:A sensible redaction. Substitute Tory for government as I agree with what you say. Politicians. Quivering mounds of love pudding, the lot of them.
Reg Bisc sez:
"If the tories could do this, THEY WOULD."
Really? Just the Tories? Oh doi be brief Reg...
Blair did alright didn't he..? He was purrrfect wasn't he...the same PM Blair who said 'oh God, not the soldiers wives as well? It's bad enough dealing with them...' when visiting Aldershot in the late 90s.
And Good Old Gordon Clown floggin' off our entire gold reserves for a pie and chips take out...then miring us and our children in debt for the next 50 yrs by getting loans left, right & centre to hand out to whoever. If you remember when CamClegg took over, the bloke who departed the treasury left a scribbled note saying 'it's all gone, there is nothing left.' on the Sec of States desk...short memory Reg?
Labour are far, far, far from perfect. Don't bash the tories because your parents did, bash the bloke making the decisions...
The country my friend, is skint.
BTW, anybody else thinks that Miliband looks 'Pit the Younger' from Blackadder III or one of the 'Banking Clan' from Start Wars Episode III?
Mulgrave
says...
4:59pm Wed 30 Jan 13
It is all very well CYC becoming such a great patron of the arts ( theatre revamp, Arts Barge grants ) but the basics, safe roads etc seem to be the price.
It may even be time to limit CYCs remit to the basics and spin everything else off into a separate entity that has to sing for its supper to fund non essential projects and services.
big boy york
says...
5:11pm Wed 30 Jan 13
PKH
says...
5:17pm Wed 30 Jan 13
ColdAsChristmas
says...
5:56pm Wed 30 Jan 13
Some of the raised cash went into Euros which are down against the £ while the value of gold has escalated.
Not flash, Gordon, no wonder you did a runner. (Where is he now?)
Incidentally, the A59 all the way to Harrogate is in a shocking state.
If it is a question of cash then how about these Japanese hybrids paying some VED?
nick clogg
says...
6:18pm Wed 30 Jan 13
ColdAsChristmas wrote:at the lowest value of gold, Gordon Brown created the recession
Gordon Brown didn't sell off our entire gold reserves Captain but he did sell off more than half, which was criminal enough.
Some of the raised cash went into Euros which are down against the £ while the value of gold has escalated.
Not flash, Gordon, no wonder you did a runner. (Where is he now?)
Incidentally, the A59 all the way to Harrogate is in a shocking state.
If it is a question of cash then how about these Japanese hybrids paying some VED?
Mulgrave
says...
6:19pm Wed 30 Jan 13
ColdAsChristmas wrote:Good point about the VED, I remember paying about £40 a year in 1976 for a 1litre Vauxhall Viva, I bought a new Mazda RX8 a few years ago and VED has gone from £210 to nearly 500 quid a year, I wouldn't mind if it went on the roads but it is just giving others a free ride, you don't even need a hybrid to be paying nothing or just £20 a year.
Gordon Brown didn't sell off our entire gold reserves Captain but he did sell off more than half, which was criminal enough.
Some of the raised cash went into Euros which are down against the £ while the value of gold has escalated.
Not flash, Gordon, no wonder you did a runner. (Where is he now?)
Incidentally, the A59 all the way to Harrogate is in a shocking state.
If it is a question of cash then how about these Japanese hybrids paying some VED?
pedalling paul
says...
6:46pm Wed 30 Jan 13
www.fillthathole.org
.uk/
Whistler2
says...
7:44pm Wed 30 Jan 13
I feel, however, that it should be possible to seal these edges without the fluid spilling over to create a slipping surface, and thus limit the number of repeat repairs.
spottycow
says...
7:52pm Wed 30 Jan 13
fear your government
says...
8:14pm Wed 30 Jan 13
spottycow wrote:dito..
Take a photo of pothole and damage to vehicle or bike and send to local council or county council and if no joy take them to small claims county court . and sue i did and they paid out ASAP.
it is more common than you think.
i drive with a measuring tape in the car, if i hit a hole, stick the tape in to get the depth take a photo and send to local council bingo...it really is that easy.
fear your government
says...
8:17pm Wed 30 Jan 13
brown end of the stick...... again.
akaroa
says...
11:53pm Wed 30 Jan 13
bob the builder
says...
12:18am Thu 31 Jan 13
pedalling paul wrote:...one of your number seems to have taken that too literally, committing crimes, this is what cycle paths leads to...
A national pothole reporting system for cyclists is at
www.fillthathole.org
.uk/
Magicman!
says...
3:02am Thu 31 Jan 13
roskoboskovic wrote:Are you on crack? Have you actually tried to cycle along half the designated cycle lanes around York? about 80% of them are below the DfT recommended minimum width for cycle lanes (some of them don't even exceed the projected width of drain covers) and so are therefore between the categories of 'risky' and 'dangerous'; then they pass by bus stops, which get used by buses, their heavy weight resting in the same place time and time again forces the road surface to sink and so creates two craters about 10 meters apart; they get all the dirt from the rest of the road chucked into them, which can obscure markings and road-level dangers such as stones/debris and pot holes; the ones on the road don't get cleared of snow and ice in the winter; and they often have cars parked on them or where there is a queue of traffic drivers decide they'll sit in the cycle lane to prevent bicycles getting past them in the raudi/4x4/new mini/zafira/generic small 'city' car....
ycc under labour have no interest in sorting out roads for the motorists.as long as that strip along the nearside is fine they re not bothered and all the newly laid designated bike paths are in good nick.
Before making comments that just show you up as being an uneducated biased commentard, try and find statistics so that there is a grain of truth in what you say.
powerwatt
says...
8:33am Thu 31 Jan 13
akaroa wrote:Yes that is right. Chelsea tractors taking kids to school are responsible for the roads across the entire of York...
Chelsea tractors ferrying privileged kids down Queen Annes road to St Olaves school, day after day ,causes huge damage, potholes, etc, to the road surface. Constant traffic, over 1000 vehicles a week have wrecked the road surface. These irresponsible pseudo aristocrats, should be made to pay for repairs,along with St Peters school. This situation hasn't changed in years and never will,.
Using narrow mindedness of just your local street without comparing to the rest of the York is silly.
Poor road quality in the UK is a major contributor, especially the old fashioned construction that people really don't use much elsewhere in the world is one factor.
The other is roads are not repaired quickly enough and so damage spreads.
The third is the weather we have had has caused the traditionally built roads to fall apart faster due to the excess water, freezing and snow conditions.
The final is the roads are hardly ever resurfaced, so the age and constant tinkering with them makes them a weaker construction.
JOHNNYG1979
says...
9:34am Thu 31 Jan 13
uriahh wrote:Can you actually claim off your local council if your vehicle is damaged by a pothole...?
Don't these idiots have any understanding of the real cost and operational benefits of a proper programme of a Preventative Maintenance on our roads.
Delayed repairs and lack of ongoing inspection and repair of minor defects as and when they occur save money in the longer term. Any failure to do this leads to escalating impact damage from traffic enlarging any defect which will lead to an escalation of more water penetration under the road surface and foundation softening and further collapse of the road surface around the defect, ultimately exascerbated by frost damage and even larger and more defcts requiring repairs. i
"Cheap" low standard repairs after significant potholes have occured in will only lead to more damage which in turn will lead to even higher bills in the near future compared with repairs being carried out properly in the first place! In addition the likely compensation payments to motorists' insurers for tyre and suspension damage and even exhaust damage will become quite significant.
And if you can bet you don't get anything...!
CYC is the gentlest council I know that can get away with digging a road up such as archer close then do a substandard job of tieing it in with the original road while making it dangerous this has been reported to York council since the site was completed over four months ago so the road now floods and is dangerous for cyclists look here what York council think is safe for cyclists http://m.youtube.com
/watch?v=Vj8dUV3PSG8
JOHNNYG1979
says...
10:19am Thu 31 Jan 13
roskoboskovic wrote:Yep and how much road tax do cyclists pay...!
ycc under labour have no interest in sorting out roads for the motorists.as long as that strip along the nearside is fine they re not bothered and all the newly laid designated bike paths are in good nick.
JOHNNYG1979
says...
10:26am Thu 31 Jan 13
ColdAsChristmas wrote:This council is prone to being dangerous mate they have aimed cars at my children when they built archer close the block paving looks like it has been layer by a two year old and has subsided already I told the council that the houses that already exist are showing signs of subsidence.
Very soon our local roads will be suitable for the likes of Land Rovers only.
The ideal solution is resurfacing but as a minimum the pot holes need to be repaired properly and promptly. Repair to a poor standard and you will end up with the same problem soon after, not cost effective at all.
I found it rather strange that the Council claim to be fighting bankruptcy while not that long since suggesting Councillors allowances be hugely increased. What planet are they on?
The business of the local authority is to serve the public. As far as road condition and clearing footpaths during icy weather they have failed the public on the most basic safety standards.
Plus reported the road that is faulty and has been over four months and the trip hazard and dangerous road still there council has no money but built 19 houses these houses won't make any money for probably a decade so are just going to suck more funds.
Shame on city of York council.
JOHNNYG1979
says...
10:52am Thu 31 Jan 13
JOHNNYG1979 wrote:Here you go look here:-
ColdAsChristmas wrote:This council is prone to being dangerous mate they have aimed cars at my children when they built archer close the block paving looks like it has been layer by a two year old and has subsided already I told the council that the houses that already exist are showing signs of subsidence.
Very soon our local roads will be suitable for the likes of Land Rovers only.
The ideal solution is resurfacing but as a minimum the pot holes need to be repaired properly and promptly. Repair to a poor standard and you will end up with the same problem soon after, not cost effective at all.
I found it rather strange that the Council claim to be fighting bankruptcy while not that long since suggesting Councillors allowances be hugely increased. What planet are they on?
The business of the local authority is to serve the public. As far as road condition and clearing footpaths during icy weather they have failed the public on the most basic safety standards.
Plus reported the road that is faulty and has been over four months and the trip hazard and dangerous road still there council has no money but built 19 houses these houses won't make any money for probably a decade so are just going to suck more funds.
Shame on city of York council.
http://i623.photobuc
ket.com/albums/tt314
/JOHNNY-G30/Archercl
ose/image_zps0d8f67d
8.jpg
http://i623.photobuc
ket.com/albums/tt314
/JOHNNY-G30/Archercl
ose/image_zps448cb62
1.jpg
BertieBrompton
says...
11:11am Thu 31 Jan 13
JOHNNYG1979 wrote:Here we go again with a road tax ignoramus!
roskoboskovic wrote:Yep and how much road tax do cyclists pay...!
ycc under labour have no interest in sorting out roads for the motorists.as long as that strip along the nearside is fine they re not bothered and all the newly laid designated bike paths are in good nick.
An answer with love from The Times....
When a driver scowls at a passing cyclist and shouts: “You have no right to be on the road - you don’t pay road tax!” are they right?
No, according to advisers at HM Revenue & Customs and the Treasury.
“Road tax” does not exist, and has not existed since the 1930s. What drivers do pay, however, is Vehicle Excise Duty, which is often known as road tax but is not strictly the same thing (a point that should have been made clear in today’s edition of The Times).
Firstly, a poll by British Cycling found that 87 per cent of its cyclist members also regularly drive cars, and so pay the same vehicle and fuel duties as other road users.
Secondly, this tax is paid into a central pot. The money made from Vehicle Excise Duty does not go directly back into the roads and highways. Cyclists - like everyone else - pay council tax, income tax and all sorts of other direct and indirect taxes which pay for the provision of public services, be they hospitals, trains or roads.
And thirdly, Vehicle Excise Duty is based on your vehicle’s emissions. Since a bike creates no emissions, it pays no Vehicle Excise Duty.
So, from a tax perspective, a cyclist has as much right to be on the road as any other road user and an extra levy would not be warranted. http://www.thetimes.
co.uk/tto/public/cyc
lesafety/article3311
131.ece
BertieBrompton
says...
11:17am Thu 31 Jan 13
Garrowby Turnoff wrote:Great website thanks....
BertieBrompton wrote:Try this website...
How do I claim for damages to my car due to poor road surfaces?
http://www.potholes.
co.uk/claims/how_to_
claim
Buzz Light-year
says...
12:46pm Thu 31 Jan 13
JOHNNYG1979 wrote:Ok so you've had a sensible and mature response from Bertie, I'll do the opposite.
roskoboskovic wrote: ycc under labour have no interest in sorting out roads for the motorists.as long as that strip along the nearside is fine they re not bothered and all the newly laid designated bike paths are in good nick.Yep and how much road tax do cyclists pay...!
No-one pays road tax and you're a pillock.
R'Marcus
says...
4:38pm Thu 31 Jan 13
BL2 wrote:You are right, of course.
I do love hearing the LibDums having a go over things that they did in the first place (not repair roads properly)!
The LibDums, in the Lady Anne Reid administration, lef our roads in a right mess. Now all we have is make do, not mend.
Our roads should be ripped up and re-made.
NickPheas
says...
1:39pm Sat 2 Feb 13
JOHNNYG1979 wrote:Yawn. I pay as much road tax as you mate. I also probably pay as much VED as well.
roskoboskovic wrote:Yep and how much road tax do cyclists pay...!
ycc under labour have no interest in sorting out roads for the motorists.as long as that strip along the nearside is fine they re not bothered and all the newly laid designated bike paths are in good nick.
BL2 says...
11:09am Wed 30 Jan 13