‘Poverty is overused word’ says Tory chief (From York Press)
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‘Poverty is overused word’ says York Conservative leader Ian Gillies
9:40am Friday 4th January 2013 in News
By Kate Liptrot, kate.liptrot@thepress.co.uk
Ian Gillies
YORK’S Conservative leader has said he believes “poverty is an overused word” in the wake of controversial comments by a member of his party about food banks.
Chris Steward, a Conservative councillor, sparked an angry row after stating there is no absolute poverty in Britain and food banks were “an insult” to starving people around the world. He said donating to them allowed recipients to spend more money on alcohol and cigarettes.
In response to the comments, Tory leader Ian Gillies said he had not yet spoken to Coun Steward but questioned how many people were in poverty, stating that while food banks “can only be a good thing” for those in need, there are some people who claim to be in need if they do not have satellite television.
Coun Gillies said: “Poverty is an overused word. Some people say they are in poverty if they can’t afford Sky television.
“But that does not detract from the people we need to help. There are obviously people in need and we should be doing everything we can to help those people.
“I would say the word poverty is used too quickly. There are people in need of help and some less fortunate than others.
“There are people who say they are in poverty but really don’t know the meaning of the word poverty.”
Coun Steward’s comments were condemned by The Trussell Trust, which runs 275 food banks nationwide, which said he was “poorly informed”.
A spokesperson for the York-based Joseph Rowntree Foundation (JRF) said: “York may be a relatively well-off city, but that only masks the very real hardship experienced by many right on our doorstep.
“Food parcels were once the preserve of wartime Britain. But such is the struggle to meet the cost of essentials, the growth of food banks is tantamount to the reality facing families today.
“Food costs for families with children have increased by about 20 per cent since 2008 and the gap between the incomes and needs of worst-off households is widening.
“Six million people in working households are now in poverty – which is testament to the prevalence of hardship in the UK. The fact is millions of ordinary people are finding it ever harder to make end meets and put food on the table.
“We need policies that help ease the real struggles faced by families, not squabbles or denial as to whether that struggle exists.”
Comments(46)
Stan2Attention
says...
9:54am Fri 4 Jan 13
Peterwalker
says...
10:06am Fri 4 Jan 13
pedalling paul
says...
10:13am Fri 4 Jan 13
I read elsewhere that Cllr. Steward is now to undertake some voluntary involvement at the Food Bank, which may temper his initially reported views.
Keeet Lemon
says...
10:29am Fri 4 Jan 13
pedalling paul wrote:You like a bit of stirring yourself don't you
Ian has sensibly tried to steer a middle course through the controversy that his junior colleague has stirred up.
I read elsewhere that Cllr. Steward is now to undertake some voluntary involvement at the Food Bank, which may temper his initially reported views.
Keeet Lemon
says...
10:32am Fri 4 Jan 13
asd
says...
10:35am Fri 4 Jan 13
perplexed
says...
10:41am Fri 4 Jan 13
Who are these 'some people '?
Where is his evidence? Such shameful and divisive stereotyping is sadly indicative of the 'poverty' we have come to expect in the quality of our politicians today! Both Coun Gillies and Coun Steward's comments are an embarrassment to the good people of York!
Zetkin
says...
10:42am Fri 4 Jan 13
If Steward thinks foodbanks are an insult to malnourished people, doesn't Gillies see that his flip comment about satellite TV is an insult to people in York and beyond who DO endure poverty, and suffer its effects on a daily basis?
The word poverty is well-used these days because so many people are affected by it. If that irriates you, Coun Gillies, why don't you and your government do something to alleviate it?
pedalling paul
says...
10:42am Fri 4 Jan 13
Keeet Lemon wrote:Who.....moi.....??
pedalling paul wrote:You like a bit of stirring yourself don't you
Ian has sensibly tried to steer a middle course through the controversy that his junior colleague has stirred up.
I read elsewhere that Cllr. Steward is now to undertake some voluntary involvement at the Food Bank, which may temper his initially reported views.
PinzaC55
says...
10:44am Fri 4 Jan 13
Buzz Light-year
says...
10:53am Fri 4 Jan 13
Coun Steward’s comments were condemned by The Trussell Trust, which runs 275 food banks nationwide,
...and almost unanimously here and on social media by all manner of commentators.
Mr Gillies has had 24 hours to come up with a tempered version.
As usual with politicians he ducks out of saying explicitly whether he backs Coun Steward's stance or condemns it.
Does he have full party support or not?
nr59
says...
11:06am Fri 4 Jan 13
cially of course.
goodfellow
says...
11:18am Fri 4 Jan 13
Oxfam
care to comment Cllr Gillies ?
outofspace
says...
11:24am Fri 4 Jan 13
Guys, you are having your Marie Antoinette moment. You might like to reflect on what happened next.
m dee
says...
11:41am Fri 4 Jan 13
pedalling paul wrote:No he has not he has backed him up and added further insulting comments,plus with you defending his comments they are doomed,should Cllr. Steward offer some voluntary involvement at the Food Bank this would surely make things worse considering his opinion which presumably still stands.
Ian has sensibly tried to steer a middle course through the controversy that his junior colleague has stirred up.
I read elsewhere that Cllr. Steward is now to undertake some voluntary involvement at the Food Bank, which may temper his initially reported views.
roskoboskovic
says...
12:11pm Fri 4 Jan 13
eeoodares
says...
12:12pm Fri 4 Jan 13
asd wrote:Norman Tebbit never said that, interesting that you choose to quote it.
What a shower of s*** these lot are. Everything has gone up except wages. The gap between the have's and have nots is gigantic. The vunrable are getting the brunt of it as usual, I am waiting for the Norman tebbit quote from someone 'Get on your bike and find work' unfortuantly I know a autistic person who has had to move as they cant afford to live in York. You may think wahts the problem, well for some-one on the spectrum this can cause trauma, depression,OCD and other contitions most people would not understand.So well done you pathetic scummy goverment for sacrificing the vunrable and poor, nice easy targets as theyt cant afford laywers or clever accountants like you rich buddy buddy mates that donate to your party's. Its a sad state of affairs in this country that food banks are now starting to be common place.
Food prices in this country are staggeringly low. It is amazing how cheap the food is. The US is the only place I have been where food appears to be cheaper but they use steroids etc.
This conversation is about poverty, if you have a 40inch+ tv, go to the pub, smoke but can not afford your electricity bill, you are not in poverty!
eeoodares
says...
12:14pm Fri 4 Jan 13
goodfellow wrote:The statistic you are quoting, where is it from, what is that level and when was it taken?
The UK is the world's six largest economy, yet 1 in 5 of the UK population live below our official poverty line, meaning that they experience life as a daily struggle.
Oxfam
care to comment Cllr Gillies ?
It sounds like a trumped up stat to me! 20%????
Trespar Zagenstuz
says...
12:58pm Fri 4 Jan 13
eeoodares wrote:Where is this statistic from?
goodfellow wrote:The statistic you are quoting, where is it from, what is that level and when was it taken?
The UK is the world's six largest economy, yet 1 in 5 of the UK population live below our official poverty line, meaning that they experience life as a daily struggle.
Oxfam
care to comment Cllr Gillies ?
It sounds like a trumped up stat to me! 20%????
I think the clue is in the word 'Oxfam'.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~
This oaf Gillies is merely pouring tory oil onto turbulent waters, in the forlorn hope of creating calm; but I think the oil is quite volatile, and might flare up in his face.
Interestingly (but inevitably), he follows caMoron's line that food banks are a sign of a healthy approach to the problems caused by his government in bringing abject poverty to millions of citizens.
Of course, they are no such thing; they are more of a savage indictment of how loathsome this government has become in accepting poverty as a norm for everybody but themselves, and failing miserably to do anything about it.
There should be no need for these soup kitchens in 2012 in Britain.
YSTClinguist
says...
1:13pm Fri 4 Jan 13
And now on with the derision about workhouse policies from the bar stewards, remember this:
http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/news/8350563/
Westminster-to-outla
w-sleeping-rough-and
-soup-kitchens.html
Trespar Zagenstuz
says...
1:44pm Fri 4 Jan 13
YSTClinguist wrote:YSTClinguist: Are you citing this reference from The Daily Telegraph as an example of 'how it should be done' ? That is, keep the great mass of starving and unwashed out of sight?
Let's keep this conversation going. No comments on Tory personages physical attributes or admin will shut the comments down.
And now on with the derision about workhouse policies from the bar stewards, remember this:
http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/news/8350563/
Westminster-to-outla
w-sleeping-rough-and
-soup-kitchens.html
YSTClinguist
says...
1:55pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Trespar Zagenstuz wrote:If you choose to follow the rabbit down the whole and drink strange potions then that may be your thinking. But alas, unfortunately we have 'cleansing' of a hideous nature where certain people don't want to be reminded daily of those who need support, and their growing numbers. Here quite frequently ex-military personnel that they sent to fight unending, unwinnable conflicts and then let off the leash back here.
YSTClinguist wrote:YSTClinguist: Are you citing this reference from The Daily Telegraph as an example of 'how it should be done' ? That is, keep the great mass of starving and unwashed out of sight?
Let's keep this conversation going. No comments on Tory personages physical attributes or admin will shut the comments down.
And now on with the derision about workhouse policies from the bar stewards, remember this:
http://www.telegraph
.co.uk/news/8350563/
Westminster-to-outla
w-sleeping-rough-and
-soup-kitchens.html
Wurlitzer
says...
2:14pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Wurlitzer
says...
2:28pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Tony Manning
says...
3:10pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Buzz Light-year
says...
3:55pm Fri 4 Jan 13
They NEED the poor.
Torkie
says...
4:22pm Fri 4 Jan 13
I'm amazed the political class don't see where they're pushing people. It seems like every day there's something disgusting to read here or at the BBC.
MilkandTwo
says...
4:46pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Trespar Zagenstuz wrote:This is this point of Cllr Steward's original comments - the definition of poverty is constantly changed.
eeoodares wrote:Where is this statistic from?
goodfellow wrote:The statistic you are quoting, where is it from, what is that level and when was it taken?
The UK is the world's six largest economy, yet 1 in 5 of the UK population live below our official poverty line, meaning that they experience life as a daily struggle.
Oxfam
care to comment Cllr Gillies ?
It sounds like a trumped up stat to me! 20%????
I think the clue is in the word 'Oxfam'.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~
This oaf Gillies is merely pouring tory oil onto turbulent waters, in the forlorn hope of creating calm; but I think the oil is quite volatile, and might flare up in his face.
Interestingly (but inevitably), he follows caMoron's line that food banks are a sign of a healthy approach to the problems caused by his government in bringing abject poverty to millions of citizens.
Of course, they are no such thing; they are more of a savage indictment of how loathsome this government has become in accepting poverty as a norm for everybody but themselves, and failing miserably to do anything about it.
There should be no need for these soup kitchens in 2012 in Britain.
Oxfam had an income of $385 million last year, mostly from Government grants (Oxfam.org.uk, annual report). If "poverty" ended there would be no need for them. So they keep redefining it.
Certainly there are people who are on hard times and should receive help. But there are also vested interests who use emotive words like poverty wrongly to advance their political aims
Trespar Zagenstuz
says...
5:19pm Fri 4 Jan 13
~~~~~~~~~~~~~#~~~~~~
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I take your point and wholeheartedly agree.
Caecilius
says...
5:20pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Make 2015 the year the British electorate eliminates the Conservative Party from politics, permanently. It did it for the Liberals: it can do it again.
south bronx red 2
says...
5:24pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Sillybillies
says...
5:29pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Interesting to see how the resident left wingers can't construct intelligent arguments but have to resort to insults based on the physical appearance of their class enemies.
moose
says...
5:33pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Wurlitzer wrote:Firstly, it's Keynesian, and secondly...do you know what Keynesian economics is?
The Tories hate the poor,they along with the Lib Dems believe in kensian capitalism,ie its not the job of the government to take care of the needy.There will be no recovery from this recession,in a year or so the gov will announce that the recession is much deeper than they first realised,cue more savage cuts.There endgame is the destruction of the welfare state..ie part of their core beliefs..kensian capitalism. They have not even started on their plans for the workers,they want you to realise that if we can be so cruel to the sick and disabled then imagine what we are prepared to do to the workers.
It is pretty much the complete opposite of what you are claiming it is - it's demand side economics, government pumping money into the economy to kick start things and create demand that the private sector is failing to do, not cuts.
For a very good recent example, see Obama's stimulus bill in the US.
The current UK govt are a million miles from Keynesianism!
moose
says...
5:36pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Sillybillies wrote:The left wingers cant construct intelligent arguments...?
I'd like to bet the users of the food bank dock fags before they go in, and light up as soon as they come out, before using their mobiles to chat inanely to their mates to brag about what they have blagged. Then no doubt they toddle off to buy cheap booze with the money saved.
Interesting to see how the resident left wingers can't construct intelligent arguments but have to resort to insults based on the physical appearance of their class enemies.
Would you like to re-read the first two sentences of your post and then explain how that constitutes an intelligent argument? Can you reference it and provide us with a bibliography? I'm fascinated to know what your peer reviewed source is...
Oh wait, you just made it up and have no evidence to suggest whether it is true or not!
It's beautifully prosaic, but is not an 'argument' as it has no evidential basis.
Silver
says...
5:56pm Fri 4 Jan 13
peterstreet
says...
6:00pm Fri 4 Jan 13
oi oi savaloy
says...
6:17pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Sillybillies wrote::) this says it all!
I'd like to bet the users of the food bank dock fags before they go in, and light up as soon as they come out, before using their mobiles to chat inanely to their mates to brag about what they have blagged. Then no doubt they toddle off to buy cheap booze with the money saved.
Interesting to see how the resident left wingers can't construct intelligent arguments but have to resort to insults based on the physical appearance of their class enemies.
The defenition of poverty in this country seems to be if you have an iPhone 4S and not a 5 and your still in last seasons Adidas tracksuit ...
Getting a bit sick of all this labour rubbish about children in poverty and stuff! No such thing in this country, just bone idle families who can't fend for themselves and would sooner **** their benefits up the wall of the ainsty or corner house pub!
moose
says...
6:26pm Fri 4 Jan 13
oi oi savaloy wrote:Factual evidence to back this up?
Sillybillies wrote::) this says it all!
I'd like to bet the users of the food bank dock fags before they go in, and light up as soon as they come out, before using their mobiles to chat inanely to their mates to brag about what they have blagged. Then no doubt they toddle off to buy cheap booze with the money saved.
Interesting to see how the resident left wingers can't construct intelligent arguments but have to resort to insults based on the physical appearance of their class enemies.
The defenition of poverty in this country seems to be if you have an iPhone 4S and not a 5 and your still in last seasons Adidas tracksuit ...
Getting a bit sick of all this labour rubbish about children in poverty and stuff! No such thing in this country, just bone idle families who can't fend for themselves and would sooner **** their benefits up the wall of the ainsty or corner house pub!
Something you once read in the Daily Mail doesn't count.
Somewhere hidden in what Cllr Gilles says is a good point - the poverty we experience in the UK is nothing compared to that of countries with no welfare state, but making flippant, divisive comments that have no obvious basis in fact to justify the assertion doesn't help the argument.
Come back when you can demonstrate objectively that everyone **** their benefits up the wall and nobody lives in poverty.
ReginaldBiscuit
says...
6:30pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Gillies, Steward. Bitter narrow-minded egomaniacs espousing division creating drivel. Still though Mr Steward, if the public go hungry and they have no food banks, they can always eat tories. A silver lining to every cloud.
Trespar Zagenstuz
says...
7:10pm Fri 4 Jan 13
"Interesting to see how the resident left wingers can't construct intelligent arguments but have to resort to insults based on the physical appearance of their class enemies."
~~~~~~~~~~~~#~~~~~~~
~~~~~
I accept that is a poor show to judge people such as Mr Gillies on appearance, but there are no arguments offered by myself, a 'resident left winger' if you must, regarding his girth.
However, one can reflect on the chap's size and extrapolate some observed notion from it. That is slightly (but only slightly !) more evidential than hearsay 'from a bloke down the pub who once thought he saw somebody stubbing his cigarette out and putting away his mobile phone prior to entering the food bank'.
....................
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..........
Incidentally, can somebody correct me or otherwise: I thought that food banks could only be used by unfortunate folk referred to them by the Job Centre, and use of such was restricted and means-tested. I am not aware one can simply nip along there and grab a hearty tin of cardboard sausages and a white sllced loaf......
nearlyman
says...
7:17pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Hoofarted wrote:Oh dear oh dear, you really have tunnel vision............Yo
Oink Oink Poverty? Oink Oink Where?
This particular Oinker sold his free taxi plate, given to him by the citizens of York's taxi licencing for multiple of thousands of pounds. Enough to stock plenty of food banks.
Pig in the troth refusing to see others go hungry. Shame on you!
ur darling MP Mr Bayley was not so long ago exposed as quite happy to claim £400 a month off the tax payer for food. (That would quite handsomely stock one of these banks). He also claims to cycle his bike round York. (he looks extremely uncomfortable on a bike, but hey, it gets a bit more publicity). He is also one of the highest claiming MP's on his expenses, despite being a spectacular underachiever.
Now who has his nose in the trough ?
.....Oh and nothing to do with faithfulness or fidelity.!
nearlyman
says...
7:21pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Buzz Light-year
says...
7:28pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Politics is a nasty business that brings out the worst in people.
Scarlet Pimpernel
says...
9:15pm Fri 4 Jan 13
Wurlitzer wrote:Total rot.
The Tories hate the poor,they along with the Lib Dems believe in kensian capitalism,ie its not the job of the government to take care of the needy.There will be no recovery from this recession,in a year or so the gov will announce that the recession is much deeper than they first realised,cue more savage cuts.There endgame is the destruction of the welfare state..ie part of their core beliefs..kensian capitalism. They have not even started on their plans for the workers,they want you to realise that if we can be so cruel to the sick and disabled then imagine what we are prepared to do to the workers.
Coun Gillies was born in Tang Hall, and I come from a council house background, and we both know about being poor. Neither of us hate the poor, and there are many conservatives from our background.
Labour politicians hate the rich, are envious of the rich, and use the poor as a way to get into power to get at the rich. They waste money, mismanage and leave a mess behind them. Look at Councillors Simpson-Laing and Merrett as an example. They are in power yet have continued to use punitive housing policies to stop housebuilding resulting in a worsening housing crisis. Why don't they do something about it ? Because they are using York as a political stick to beat the coalition government with. By stopping housebuilding they are using this to blame the government. They have now been found out because York's housing completions continue to fall as surrounding areas improve, exposing Labour's mismanagement. Things are now so bad that they will be forced to make policy changes, but, it's too late to save them and York's housing numbers will not recover for years, and we will be behind the rest of the region in recovery.
twotonethomas
says...
9:19pm Fri 4 Jan 13
NoNewsIsGoodNews says...
9:46am Fri 4 Jan 13