Time for change? (From York Press)

It's up to Stagecoach - they've got the same freedom to muscle in and start running buses as anyone else if they want.

My experience of the company is different to Mr Scott's - I've always found them to be every bit as bad as First wherever I've had the misfortune to use their services.

Stagecoach also has the added disadvantage of being owned by the obnoxious Brian Souter.

If people are that implacably opposed to First then they need to start using other companies' buses - even if that means a slower or less frequent journey, or a slightly longer walk. Most areas of the city are within easy walking distance of a non-First bus route, but as long as people continue to make use of the convenience that First offer, the company will remain in a dominant position. Apart from the P&R their routes are operated commercially, so no-one has the authority to overthrow them – the only way for it to happen is through commercial competition on the streets, and by passengers voting with their feet.

Buses in London may well run a better service, but that is because they are very heavily subsidised – not something that York can afford to do.

I have never ever in my life paid a bus fare with First and I don't intend to start.
They will never ever get any of my money.

Buzz Light-year wrote:
I have never ever in my life paid a bus fare with First and I don't intend to start.
They will never ever get any of my money.

no but i bet you show up when your 60 plus

I had somebyd visit me from Brighouse a while back, when York Pullman were still operating service buses, and his visit was timed around getting the 55 back to the train station so he didn't have to line First's pockets!

there is currently a lot of contention around the Nexus PTE area (tyne and wear) because they want to introduce Quality Contracts, a way of franchising bus routes out - and the bus operators state that it is a waste of money and won't benefit passengers.... And the simple fact is that THERE, that is correct. Go-Ahead and Stagecoach provide a reliable and respectable bus service, with Stagecoach regularly investing in new vehicles and having recently purchased a fleet of AlexanderDennis Enviro400 Hybrid double deckers like the green and white double decker we had on the a good while back - of which NOTHING has progressed on that trial has it? ... but up in Nexus county, Quality Contracts don't seem to be needed, in the same was as they wouldn't be needed in South Manchester. BUT the other two PTE areas considering Quality Contracts are Metro (west yorkshire) and Travel South Yorkshire - both of which have a heavy bus influence from a certain white and pink one. It's just a massive shame that York, despite being counted as the Leeds City Region in other areas, isn't actually within the Metro zone, because if it was then we'd be getting much better value for money bus fares and we'd have a few more newer buses by now too as well as more routes.

First group ruining bus travel is by no means unique to York, it is nationwide. People in many places have been boycotting them for several years, leading to many depots losing money hand over fist so that Tim O' Toole (new manager of First Group, appointed just a few months ago) has had to draw up a list to sell off numerous bus depots and fleets in order to recouperate some big losses. An inside source has told me Halifax is to be told, though this cannot be confirmed, but I have nothing substantial as yet for whether York will get sold or not.... Obviously we're all hoping it does, but the main problem then is who would take it on? Transdev would not be alowed to due to Competition Commission rules, and there may also be similar issues if Arriva or East Yorkshire Motor Services wanted to buy the depot and fleet. Stagecoach might be one possible, but with York being pretty much an outpost being a good old distance from the nearest current Stagecoach fleet, it seems less likely. In addition I have had a bad experience with Stagecoach once, whereby their driver went the wrong way around Grasmere village on the very last service of the day and purposefully drove on the wrong side of an A road to avoid stopping to pick us up, and then when we challenged the company they insulted us saying the driver presumed we were drunk, and they were taking the drivers side.

This then leaves three other main candidates: Rotala, Centrebus, and Go-Ahead group. I don't know enough about Rotala to comment on them, but Centrebus has been taking up a lot of routes in West yorkshire as First has been dropping them like hot potatoes - so much so that LeedsBradford Airport has specifically told Metro not to allow First to run any bus services that bring passengers to the airport! The Centrebus fleet in Leeds is much newer than the buses First had been putting on the routes when they had been running them. The we have Go-Ahead group - the largest bus operator up in Geordie land, GNE has a strong brand presence with branded buses STICKING to the route they are branded for (and by branding I mean each branded route has it's own livery, not just a strap line with the bus number on the side and then some giant monstrous winking eye or an ugly baby on the side like Firstgroup use), with good vehicle maintenance, regular cleaning of the vehicles, and friendly staff - GNE have built up their good reputation and standard of service from scratch, as opposed to simply buying out the owning companies of local operators as Firstgroup did - as Rider York was part of Yorkshire Rider which was owned by Badgerline, which then got bought out by Grampian Regional Transport who then rebranded as FirstBus.

Why do you think Transdev wouldn't be allowed to buy First York? They would have no more of a monopoly than First did ten years ago. With plenty of other buses run by Arriva, East Yorkshire, Stephensons and Reliance, there would be competition on all the main corridors, and if P&R was awarded separately then Transdev would run little more than half of the city's services.

daveyboy25 wrote:

Buzz Light-year wrote: I have never ever in my life paid a bus fare with First and I don't intend to start. They will never ever get any of my money.

no but i bet you show up when your 60 plus

Nope.
I'll show up when they stop employing dangerous bullies as drivers.