Vile and cruel method of producing meat (From York Press)

How about battery farmed chickens then?

More right-wing ramblings; Brilliant stuff. In fact i do believe that halal meat is stated on takeaways etc. Quite simply, if you don't like it; don't eat it.

spiritofyork wrote:
More right-wing ramblings; Brilliant stuff. In fact i do believe that halal meat is stated on takeaways etc. Quite simply, if you don't like it; don't eat it.

Not everywhere SoY. It should be a choice to eat it and a choice not to. At present it isn't so. No problem in offering people the choice.

Personally, I find halal meat delicious. I understand halal involves far more than just the way the animal is killed; there is a religious duty to treat the animals with respect, which in general means they will enjoy a far better life than most of the besats who end up on our plates and in our takeaways.
`
It's quite amazing to see how many loony right wingers have become concerned about the rights of animals (and women) in recent years.

Zetkin wrote:
Personally, I find halal meat delicious. I understand halal involves far more than just the way the animal is killed; there is a religious duty to treat the animals with respect, which in general means they will enjoy a far better life than most of the besats who end up on our plates and in our takeaways. ` It's quite amazing to see how many loony right wingers have become concerned about the rights of animals (and women) in recent years.

Personally I think it's an attempt to try to get people more onside with their ideas. Besides whilst Halal has it's issues so does Veal, Foie Gras, Battery farming oh and not forgetting animal testing of cosmetics so if we're getting into a religious debate these practices are ok to christians but animal lovers don't like them. My view is if it tastes good eat it.

York Fox wrote:

spiritofyork wrote: More right-wing ramblings; Brilliant stuff. In fact i do believe that halal meat is stated on takeaways etc. Quite simply, if you don't like it; don't eat it.

Not everywhere SoY. It should be a choice to eat it and a choice not to. At present it isn't so. No problem in offering people the choice.

I should add that I don't care much either way. If it tastes good I'll eat it, and I don't think there is any difference in taste!

David Quarrie's letters get more and more fundamentalist every time.
He should pop to a nearby bacon factory or as Silver says a battery hen "farm", he seems to need a little perspective and I'd much rather read opinions from experience rather than second-hand tabloid incitement.
.

It's quite amazing to see how many loony right wingers have become concerned about the rights of animals (and women) in recent years.

Haha very good point Zetkin!
Who'd have thought it? Daily Mail reading bunny-huggers! Hahaha!

Kosher as well. But is the medical facts right in the letter? A quick slit to the carotid artery and subsequent blood loss induces gradual drowsiness. Not on-going pain as suggested

Although at the moment there is a current inconsistency of whether or not Halal meat is actually Halal. As there's no certificate saying it actually is. So a lot of slaughter houses are actually just saying they are so they can mark up their meats by 40%.

David Quarrie has almost cornered the market in thinly-veiled racism. No mention of Kosher meat I notice though it is prepared in much the same way. This is not unconnected with the fact that ultra-right extremists now back Israel as the most Islamophibic state.
As usual, Quarrie has got it wrong, over 90%of animals are stunned in the preparation of Halal meat.(easy to check online)
But stunned or unstunned I wouldn't eat a Nazi

Diogenes wrote:
David Quarrie has almost cornered the market in thinly-veiled racism. No mention of Kosher meat I notice though it is prepared in much the same way. This is not unconnected with the fact that ultra-right extremists now back Israel as the most Islamophibic state. As usual, Quarrie has got it wrong, over 90%of animals are stunned in the preparation of Halal meat.(easy to check online) But stunned or unstunned I wouldn't eat a Nazi

I'd call David Quarrie a traditionalist and someone who objects to the adoption of laws and rules that are alien to our (british) way of life. We live our life in a certain way and if this offends those who wish to live here, then my advice is, like it or lump it, or take a hike.
You liberal ultra-tolerant types do this country no favours, and surrender our values to those that have no respect for our laws and traditions.
Call me a looney right-winger, a racist and a nazi why don't you ? Sticks and stones...... !!!!

Alucard wrote:
Kosher as well. But is the medical facts right in the letter? A quick slit to the carotid artery and subsequent blood loss induces gradual drowsiness. Not on-going pain as suggested

If this was a more humane way of slaughtering then why isn't it adopted as the norm ?
I suppose you will claim that it doesn't cause any distress to the animal next ?
Ban it now !

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Diogenes wrote:
David Quarrie has almost cornered the market in thinly-veiled racism. No mention of Kosher meat I notice though it is prepared in much the same way. This is not unconnected with the fact that ultra-right extremists now back Israel as the most Islamophibic state. As usual, Quarrie has got it wrong, over 90%of animals are stunned in the preparation of Halal meat.(easy to check online) But stunned or unstunned I wouldn't eat a Nazi

I'd call David Quarrie a traditionalist and someone who objects to the adoption of laws and rules that are alien to our (british) way of life. We live our life in a certain way and if this offends those who wish to live here, then my advice is, like it or lump it, or take a hike.
You liberal ultra-tolerant types do this country no favours, and surrender our values to those that have no respect for our laws and traditions.
Call me a looney right-winger, a racist and a nazi why don't you ? Sticks and stones...... !!!!

Ummm not called him anything but misinformed myself. But I do find taking an intolerance stance on a religion's approach to slaughtering an animal for food compared to something that we british people do ourselves. Halal and battery farming are both bad. To pick on one and ignore the other smacks of rascism. You can't pick and choose whats wrong with what people eat it should be all or nothing. Besides it's only an animal, I wouldn't really call that view, ultra tolerant myself. I'd call that not caring and will be disliked for that opinion with animal lovers but I think I'll live with it.

Silver wrote:

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Diogenes wrote: David Quarrie has almost cornered the market in thinly-veiled racism. No mention of Kosher meat I notice though it is prepared in much the same way. This is not unconnected with the fact that ultra-right extremists now back Israel as the most Islamophibic state. As usual, Quarrie has got it wrong, over 90%of animals are stunned in the preparation of Halal meat.(easy to check online) But stunned or unstunned I wouldn't eat a Nazi

I'd call David Quarrie a traditionalist and someone who objects to the adoption of laws and rules that are alien to our (british) way of life. We live our life in a certain way and if this offends those who wish to live here, then my advice is, like it or lump it, or take a hike. You liberal ultra-tolerant types do this country no favours, and surrender our values to those that have no respect for our laws and traditions. Call me a looney right-winger, a racist and a nazi why don't you ? Sticks and stones...... !!!!

Ummm not called him anything but misinformed myself. But I do find taking an intolerance stance on a religion's approach to slaughtering an animal for food compared to something that we british people do ourselves. Halal and battery farming are both bad. To pick on one and ignore the other smacks of rascism. You can't pick and choose whats wrong with what people eat it should be all or nothing. Besides it's only an animal, I wouldn't really call that view, ultra tolerant myself. I'd call that not caring and will be disliked for that opinion with animal lovers but I think I'll live with it.

Ban battery farming
Ban foie gras
Ban Hal'al meat
Ban pandering to the religious beliefs of immigrants where the laws of this land are compromised !!!

Are you happy now ?

This is an extremely important question; I'm perturbed by the fact that condemnation of cruelty to animals is equated with being racist. Continually harping on about immigrants on benefits, or the country being "full of asylum seekers" IS racist. Concern about hanging a fully conscious animal upside down and letting it bleed to death is certainly NOT racist.

Some say that the halal method of slaughter is painless. My opinion would be that the law decrees animals to be stunned for a reason. I had a quick look on Google; the main opposition to Halal appears to be from animal welfare organisations; not the BNP. That's good enough for me.

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Silver wrote:

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Diogenes wrote: David Quarrie has almost cornered the market in thinly-veiled racism. No mention of Kosher meat I notice though it is prepared in much the same way. This is not unconnected with the fact that ultra-right extremists now back Israel as the most Islamophibic state. As usual, Quarrie has got it wrong, over 90%of animals are stunned in the preparation of Halal meat.(easy to check online) But stunned or unstunned I wouldn't eat a Nazi

I'd call David Quarrie a traditionalist and someone who objects to the adoption of laws and rules that are alien to our (british) way of life. We live our life in a certain way and if this offends those who wish to live here, then my advice is, like it or lump it, or take a hike. You liberal ultra-tolerant types do this country no favours, and surrender our values to those that have no respect for our laws and traditions. Call me a looney right-winger, a racist and a nazi why don't you ? Sticks and stones...... !!!!

Ummm not called him anything but misinformed myself. But I do find taking an intolerance stance on a religion's approach to slaughtering an animal for food compared to something that we british people do ourselves. Halal and battery farming are both bad. To pick on one and ignore the other smacks of rascism. You can't pick and choose whats wrong with what people eat it should be all or nothing. Besides it's only an animal, I wouldn't really call that view, ultra tolerant myself. I'd call that not caring and will be disliked for that opinion with animal lovers but I think I'll live with it.

Ban battery farming
Ban foie gras
Ban Hal'al meat
Ban pandering to the religious beliefs of immigrants where the laws of this land are compromised !!!

Are you happy now ?

But if the laws of this land aren't compromised then it's not an issue. If they stun the animal to make it Halal it's not an issue is it? Which makes the point of this letter pointless.

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Alucard wrote: Kosher as well. But is the medical facts right in the letter? A quick slit to the carotid artery and subsequent blood loss induces gradual drowsiness. Not on-going pain as suggested

If this was a more humane way of slaughtering then why isn't it adopted as the norm ? I suppose you will claim that it doesn't cause any distress to the animal next ? Ban it now !

Don't suppose what people might say, stick to facts as stated and not conjecture.
On your point about stress, we can't know if any method is stress free, point is that medically a slit artery does not produce pain.

OK Duck in the Hedge, WB 75 etc, (and the Quarrie person) if your concern is animal welfare and not Islamophobia, lets hear it loud and clear that you condemn Kosher slaughter also, it is almost identical to Halal, after all both Arabs and Jews are Semitic people.
Silence on your part on this issue will speak volumes about your true motives

Diogenes wrote:
OK Duck in the Hedge, WB 75 etc, (and the Quarrie person) if your concern is animal welfare and not Islamophobia, lets hear it loud and clear that you condemn Kosher slaughter also, it is almost identical to Halal, after all both Arabs and Jews are Semitic people.
Silence on your part on this issue will speak volumes about your true motives

Well said

Diogenes wrote:
OK Duck in the Hedge, WB 75 etc, (and the Quarrie person) if your concern is animal welfare and not Islamophobia, lets hear it loud and clear that you condemn Kosher slaughter also, it is almost identical to Halal, after all both Arabs and Jews are Semitic people. Silence on your part on this issue will speak volumes about your true motives

Ok, I condemn kosher slaughter also, but not only because I am concerned with animal welfare. I am also concerned about the constant erosion of our (british) laws and traditions, and being made to feel like a second class citizen in my own country. Those of you who speak out for and support changes for the benefit of those that come here seeking to change our ways of life to the point where we lose our identity, should decide where your loyalties lay.
I was brought up to be respectful and when I visit the homes or lands of others, I respect their values, laws and beliefs and do not expect them to change anything for my benefit.
Those of you, who label those of us who resent having our values and identity eroded, as racist, are the ones with a phobia....... you tell me which ? Is it a phobia of britishness or a phobia of standing up for your country ? I don't have a problem with those that come here and abide by our laws and respect our traditions, but, those that come here expecting to impose their ways on us should go elsewhere. If that is being a racist, then so be it.

Pretty skewed philosophy that one, Duck.
You appear to have some kind of victim syndrome.
What my neighbour does in his own home is up to him and has no bearing whatsoever on how I feel I should live my life or my perceived status in society. I don't feel threatened or belittled by what he does.
.
If you are so concerned about invasion of our culture then why aren't you up in arms about the US? Their influence has been far more pervasive and pernicious.
Our entertainment media has been all but commandeered by them. We've had years of US TV shows, US music in our charts the magazine racks are chock full of silly gossip about silly US celebs.
Our citizens are even beginning to behave like vainglorious Hollywood hacks, having their teeth whitened, getting botox and starving themselves.
.
As for equating concern for animals with racism, that is also skewed. It was merely remarked upon that it was strange that the sort of folk who usually regard anyone with an interest in animal welfare as loony bunny huggers now all of a sudden were all up in arms about the poor things being stuck in the neck, and what a coincidence that this just happened to relate to islam.

TooRelaxed wrote:
Pretty skewed philosophy that one, Duck. You appear to have some kind of victim syndrome. What my neighbour does in his own home is up to him and has no bearing whatsoever on how I feel I should live my life or my perceived status in society. I don't feel threatened or belittled by what he does. . If you are so concerned about invasion of our culture then why aren't you up in arms about the US? Their influence has been far more pervasive and pernicious. Our entertainment media has been all but commandeered by them. We've had years of US TV shows, US music in our charts the magazine racks are chock full of silly gossip about silly US celebs. Our citizens are even beginning to behave like vainglorious Hollywood hacks, having their teeth whitened, getting botox and starving themselves. . As for equating concern for animals with racism, that is also skewed. It was merely remarked upon that it was strange that the sort of folk who usually regard anyone with an interest in animal welfare as loony bunny huggers now all of a sudden were all up in arms about the poor things being stuck in the neck, and what a coincidence that this just happened to relate to islam.

An Englishman home is his castle as TooRelaxed succinctly put and what they do inside it is their business but to get certain products they have to be produced and if they're buying British, does it really matter if any form of religious clergy say a few words over the animal?

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Diogenes wrote: OK Duck in the Hedge, WB 75 etc, (and the Quarrie person) if your concern is animal welfare and not Islamophobia, lets hear it loud and clear that you condemn Kosher slaughter also, it is almost identical to Halal, after all both Arabs and Jews are Semitic people. Silence on your part on this issue will speak volumes about your true motives

Ok, I condemn kosher slaughter also, but not only because I am concerned with animal welfare. I am also concerned about the constant erosion of our (british) laws and traditions, and being made to feel like a second class citizen in my own country. Those of you who speak out for and support changes for the benefit of those that come here seeking to change our ways of life to the point where we lose our identity, should decide where your loyalties lay. I was brought up to be respectful and when I visit the homes or lands of others, I respect their values, laws and beliefs and do not expect them to change anything for my benefit. Those of you, who label those of us who resent having our values and identity eroded, as racist, are the ones with a phobia....... you tell me which ? Is it a phobia of britishness or a phobia of standing up for your country ? I don't have a problem with those that come here and abide by our laws and respect our traditions, but, those that come here expecting to impose their ways on us should go elsewhere. If that is being a racist, then so be it.

Well said Duck. Now wait for the looney left to have a go at you!

Zebedee wrote:

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Diogenes wrote: OK Duck in the Hedge, WB 75 etc, (and the Quarrie person) if your concern is animal welfare and not Islamophobia, lets hear it loud and clear that you condemn Kosher slaughter also, it is almost identical to Halal, after all both Arabs and Jews are Semitic people. Silence on your part on this issue will speak volumes about your true motives

Ok, I condemn kosher slaughter also, but not only because I am concerned with animal welfare. I am also concerned about the constant erosion of our (british) laws and traditions, and being made to feel like a second class citizen in my own country. Those of you who speak out for and support changes for the benefit of those that come here seeking to change our ways of life to the point where we lose our identity, should decide where your loyalties lay. I was brought up to be respectful and when I visit the homes or lands of others, I respect their values, laws and beliefs and do not expect them to change anything for my benefit. Those of you, who label those of us who resent having our values and identity eroded, as racist, are the ones with a phobia....... you tell me which ? Is it a phobia of britishness or a phobia of standing up for your country ? I don't have a problem with those that come here and abide by our laws and respect our traditions, but, those that come here expecting to impose their ways on us should go elsewhere. If that is being a racist, then so be it.

Well said Duck. Now wait for the looney left to have a go at you!

They just don't get it Zebedee, or maybe they want us to be Islamified ?
They will say that I am paranoid, but, I see it for what it is - a take-over bid !
Shahid Malik said at GPU 2008, '....at this rate the whole parliament will be muslim !.... and I'm confident that in the next thirty years or so, we will see a Prime Minister who shares my faith !'
An Indian Doctor who practiced as a gynaecologist, told me that muslims who he suggested should consider sterilisation, would always respond that they would not, because they wanted even larger families. He himself was an immigrant but, he said that we do not see what is going on, and it's an attempt at taking over !
This offends me, and I do not want to become a minority in MY OWN COUNTRY !

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Zebedee wrote:

Duck in the hedge wrote:

Diogenes wrote: OK Duck in the Hedge, WB 75 etc, (and the Quarrie person) if your concern is animal welfare and not Islamophobia, lets hear it loud and clear that you condemn Kosher slaughter also, it is almost identical to Halal, after all both Arabs and Jews are Semitic people. Silence on your part on this issue will speak volumes about your true motives

Ok, I condemn kosher slaughter also, but not only because I am concerned with animal welfare. I am also concerned about the constant erosion of our (british) laws and traditions, and being made to feel like a second class citizen in my own country. Those of you who speak out for and support changes for the benefit of those that come here seeking to change our ways of life to the point where we lose our identity, should decide where your loyalties lay. I was brought up to be respectful and when I visit the homes or lands of others, I respect their values, laws and beliefs and do not expect them to change anything for my benefit. Those of you, who label those of us who resent having our values and identity eroded, as racist, are the ones with a phobia....... you tell me which ? Is it a phobia of britishness or a phobia of standing up for your country ? I don't have a problem with those that come here and abide by our laws and respect our traditions, but, those that come here expecting to impose their ways on us should go elsewhere. If that is being a racist, then so be it.

Well said Duck. Now wait for the looney left to have a go at you!

They just don't get it Zebedee, or maybe they want us to be Islamified ? They will say that I am paranoid, but, I see it for what it is - a take-over bid ! Shahid Malik said at GPU 2008, '....at this rate the whole parliament will be muslim !.... and I'm confident that in the next thirty years or so, we will see a Prime Minister who shares my faith !' An Indian Doctor who practiced as a gynaecologist, told me that muslims who he suggested should consider sterilisation, would always respond that they would not, because they wanted even larger families. He himself was an immigrant but, he said that we do not see what is going on, and it's an attempt at taking over ! This offends me, and I do not want to become a minority in MY OWN COUNTRY !

So you probably had an issue with Obama becoming president in the US?
Everyone is technically an immigrant after all humanity didn't start to evolve in England. Besides seeing as the majority of what you'd call British. Our dominant religion is waning. If you truly want to stop the spread of Islam shouldn't you be spreading the holy word of our religion instead of slamming another?
Judge Not Lest Ye Be Judged.
Christian words that apply very aptly to this methinks

Silver, don't give me that historical technical melting pot nonsense. The world is a smaller place, and this island is becoming overcrowded. I'm also not being drawn into a religious mud-slinging match.
Look, I'm old fashioned, I like our traditions, our ways and our values. I don't want hal'al or kosher meat, I don't want sharia law and being over-run with muslims who have no respect for me or my way of life. They play the race card at every opportunity, yet they are the ones that are intolerant. Enough is enough, stop this Islamification now !!!
Right wing ? Right on !

But no one is saying you have to eat Halal meat.....
I don't eat Halal and whilst the south is getting overcrowded places like Scotland have a lot of vacant space.
We can't have Sharia Law mainly because we already have our own legal system. Although it is true some communities in a way police themselves with things that are taboo etc we do it ourselves. But I don't think there has been a letter into the press about the urgent need to have Halal meat butchers in York. I'm just saying it means it's rather redunant and pointless and you've been unable to explain to me how it is "They" are attacking our morality with logical reason. Mainly you've just spouted the equivalent of what some guy in a pub told you instead of facts.
Besides if we didn't have immigrants we wouldn't have Chinese or Indian takeaways and I for one love those cusines.

I love chinese food too, and other nationalities could learn a thing or two from the chinese....... like how to integrate and behave, with respect, politeness and good manners !!!!
The next super power ?
Don't start on about human rights.
I also have no problem with Buddhism, and I will leave you with a quote,
'Life is already pure. Just don't bring the dirt or rubbish to it' (Venerable Phramaha Sangthong Dhammacaro)
I'll let you figure the message ? !!

Duck in the hedge wrote:
I love chinese food too, and other nationalities could learn a thing or two from the chinese....... like how to integrate and behave, with respect, politeness and good manners !!!!
The next super power ?
Don't start on about human rights.
I also have no problem with Buddhism, and I will leave you with a quote,
'Life is already pure. Just don't bring the dirt or rubbish to it' (Venerable Phramaha Sangthong Dhammacaro)
I'll let you figure the message ? !!

Don't bring in negative thoughts to others. Sure people are different but we all are.
Seriously try a hard one, also the sound of one hand clapping is cl the other hand makes the ap bit of the sound.

Ther is no way that the UK will become a sharia state, despite what EDL propaganda leads you to believe. British values promote tolerance, and if you are not being tolerant then how are you being 'traditional'? The paranoid right continue to amaze me with their adherence to propaganda.

There are believers of propaganda on one side and those ignorant of reality on the other. Both sides are on here. The truth, as always, is somewhere down the middle, but it is becoming impossible to discuss and act on issues either way without claims of racism or islamification. These are very serious issues with a potentially massive impact on Britain, for better or for worse.

Halal animals are cut while stood upright. The rules are very strict. The cut is extremely deep, the animal does scream, but it experiences brain death within about 5 seconds. They should never be hung by the feet by Halal rules. Any halal slaughterman who does this breaks the halal ritual.

Only one animal is slaughtered at a time and all traces of blood must be removed and prayers made before the next animal enters, because Muslims believe that tormenting animals offends God, and seek to prevent the animal smelling death and getting afraid.

That is the ideal anyway, I don't know about the practise. It sounds horrific.

Compare this with our own slaughterhouses which have a conveyor belt of hundreds of animals, being killed one after the other, endlessly, often day and night. They witness the animals in front dying, inadequate stunning is rife, terrified animals being beaten is rife (animal aid have been secret filming in a wide selection of uk slaughterhouses and found violent abuse or rule breaking in all I'm afraid).

Scientific research where food animals have had implants inserted while on farms have shown that there is a high chance that fully stunned mammals are also fully conscious and aware, but paralysed. Also, because they are hung by the feet, blood pools in the brain and brain death can take up to ten minutes, by which time they may all ready be being exposed to boiling water or boiling steam ready for skinning.

Neither is nice, but meat is never going to be nice. There is no kind way to kill, it is messy, but you can make it less painful and faster and I think UK slaughter houses are probably doing a messier job of it than Halal (if halal is properly adhered to).

An answer is to push for compulsory 24/7 CCTV in all slaughterhouses, and initiate a government review of the effectiveness of stunning.

Stun Bolt and Pithing (where the stunned animals brain is mashed up and destroyed in a few seconds before further stunning and then sticking (throat cutting) was more humane but was banned during the mad cow disease panic, and now mammals are stunned and cut with their brains still in tact, which is of concern to Compassion in World Farming.

I agree with any concern about animal suffering but our indigenous hands are not as clean as we would like I am afraid.