Appalling welcome for York's visitors

York Press: Appalling welcome for York's visitors Appalling welcome for York's visitors

IT COULD be assumed that the majority of local drivers are now well aware of the closure of Lendal Bridge and that most of those being penalised are therefore visitors to the city.

Does this not make the case that either the signage is inadequate, or that the whole concept is flawed?

Whatever the reason, it is an appalling way to treat visitors.

Peter Hawley, Almond Grove, New Earswick, York.

Comments (28)

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4:25pm Thu 2 Jan 14

Kelvar says...

Absolutely appalling! But as this current Council (and it's car hating Councillors) see it as a 'Cash Cow' I doubt they will do ANYTHING about it...Roll on the Council Elections! Alexander & Merrett et al OUT!
Absolutely appalling! But as this current Council (and it's car hating Councillors) see it as a 'Cash Cow' I doubt they will do ANYTHING about it...Roll on the Council Elections! Alexander & Merrett et al OUT! Kelvar

5:10pm Thu 2 Jan 14

Jonthan says...

"Merrett et al OUT"

Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance.
Hope you are OK with that
"Merrett et al OUT" Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance. Hope you are OK with that Jonthan

5:48pm Thu 2 Jan 14

hardlybelievable says...

The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.
The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city. hardlybelievable

6:19pm Thu 2 Jan 14

Igiveinthen says...

Jonthan wrote:
"Merrett et al OUT"

Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance.
Hope you are OK with that
Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?.
To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.
[quote][p][bold]Jonthan[/bold] wrote: "Merrett et al OUT" Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance. Hope you are OK with that[/p][/quote]Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?. To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to. Igiveinthen

6:28pm Thu 2 Jan 14

Starboard22 says...

I bet Sentamu's driver has a pass to cross over Lendal Bridge without incurring a penalty. Pity the poor plebs from far and wide not being so lucky.
Why shop in York anyway when there is Leeds and Harrogate close by.
I bet Sentamu's driver has a pass to cross over Lendal Bridge without incurring a penalty. Pity the poor plebs from far and wide not being so lucky. Why shop in York anyway when there is Leeds and Harrogate close by. Starboard22

8:55pm Thu 2 Jan 14

ColdAsChristmas says...

No 5 in the UK's Cr*p Towns list. Say no more.
No 5 in the UK's Cr*p Towns list. Say no more. ColdAsChristmas

9:39pm Thu 2 Jan 14

bolero says...

So now we know. Jonthan is green.
So now we know. Jonthan is green. bolero

10:38pm Thu 2 Jan 14

Jonthan says...

ColdAsChristmas wrote:
No 5 in the UK's Cr*p Towns list. Say no more.
As I have told you before, that cr*p town list was a spoof. You readily believe fiction don't you? Especially the conspiracy theory stuff about climate change denial.
Anyway Happy New Year ColdAs, there may be hope for you in 2014.
[quote][p][bold]ColdAsChristmas[/bold] wrote: No 5 in the UK's Cr*p Towns list. Say no more.[/p][/quote]As I have told you before, that cr*p town list was a spoof. You readily believe fiction don't you? Especially the conspiracy theory stuff about climate change denial. Anyway Happy New Year ColdAs, there may be hope for you in 2014. Jonthan

1:26am Fri 3 Jan 14

Magicman! says...

hardlybelievable wrote:
The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.
"Labour - they nearly broke the country"... Well if labour NEARLY broke the country, then the Tories HAVE broken the country now.
[quote][p][bold]hardlybelievable[/bold] wrote: The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.[/p][/quote]"Labour - they nearly broke the country"... Well if labour NEARLY broke the country, then the Tories HAVE broken the country now. Magicman!

1:34am Fri 3 Jan 14

Magicman! says...

Igiveinthen wrote:
Jonthan wrote:
"Merrett et al OUT"

Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance.
Hope you are OK with that
Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?.
To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.
"The majority of commenters don't"

The most any lendal bridge article has had is just under 200 comments, many being from the same people making different comments on the same article (or in the case of CHISSY, having an immature argument with somebody over about 10 or more posts)... Just because an article has 100-200 comments, the majority of which are negative, does NOT in any way reflect the attitude of the city as a whole. Even if an articicle had 200 comments all of which were negative and all from different people, it would still not make up the majority concensus of the population of the city... a lot of people don't comment because they think it's fine; in situations such as this, general human nature is to complain and want somebody to hear it - so people will come on here to complain, and it is most likely that every single person who disagrees with the scheme has put a comment on this website or written a letter; so all-in-all about 200 people disagree with the closure against the city population of hundreds of thousands of people.

And finally, if people are visiting York by car and then using the car to make silly little journeys just from Monk Bar to the NRM for example, then I personally think it's a good thing they won't be returning - they can go and create their own traffic jams elsewhere.
[quote][p][bold]Igiveinthen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jonthan[/bold] wrote: "Merrett et al OUT" Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance. Hope you are OK with that[/p][/quote]Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?. To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.[/p][/quote]"The majority of commenters don't" The most any lendal bridge article has had is just under 200 comments, many being from the same people making different comments on the same article (or in the case of CHISSY, having an immature argument with somebody over about 10 or more posts)... Just because an article has 100-200 comments, the majority of which are negative, does NOT in any way reflect the attitude of the city as a whole. Even if an articicle had 200 comments all of which were negative and all from different people, it would still not make up the majority concensus of the population of the city... a lot of people don't comment because they think it's fine; in situations such as this, general human nature is to complain and want somebody to hear it - so people will come on here to complain, and it is most likely that every single person who disagrees with the scheme has put a comment on this website or written a letter; so all-in-all about 200 people disagree with the closure against the city population of hundreds of thousands of people. And finally, if people are visiting York by car and then using the car to make silly little journeys just from Monk Bar to the NRM for example, then I personally think it's a good thing they won't be returning - they can go and create their own traffic jams elsewhere. Magicman!

6:38am Fri 3 Jan 14

Igiveinthen says...

Magicman! says..., I take it from your comment you are in favour of the bridge restrictions, and you try to put a case that the majority of York residents are in favour of it as well, you also come across as an anti-car subscriber, an attitude can't quite understand, people have choices and irrespective of what I or you think will make their own decisions on their mode of transport.
The point of the argument that I am making is that there is something radically wrong with the way this bridge restriction has been handled, and I am convinced that c30,0000 drivers cannot all be wrong or cavalier in their attitude to this restricted access issue.
I have witnessed two instances where the car in front of me was hesitant as to which lane to use, both instances where since the matrix sign was installed, I managed to prevent one driver crossing but unfortunately the other was too quick for me and went across, adding to the cash flow of the council coffers.
Magicman! says..., I take it from your comment you are in favour of the bridge restrictions, and you try to put a case that the majority of York residents are in favour of it as well, you also come across as an anti-car subscriber, an attitude can't quite understand, people have choices and irrespective of what I or you think will make their own decisions on their mode of transport. The point of the argument that I am making is that there is something radically wrong with the way this bridge restriction has been handled, and I am convinced that c30,0000 drivers cannot all be wrong or cavalier in their attitude to this restricted access issue. I have witnessed two instances where the car in front of me was hesitant as to which lane to use, both instances where since the matrix sign was installed, I managed to prevent one driver crossing but unfortunately the other was too quick for me and went across, adding to the cash flow of the council coffers. Igiveinthen

9:15am Fri 3 Jan 14

AGuyFromStrensall says...

Magicman! wrote:
Igiveinthen wrote:
Jonthan wrote:
"Merrett et al OUT"

Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance.
Hope you are OK with that
Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?.
To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.
"The majority of commenters don't"

The most any lendal bridge article has had is just under 200 comments, many being from the same people making different comments on the same article (or in the case of CHISSY, having an immature argument with somebody over about 10 or more posts)... Just because an article has 100-200 comments, the majority of which are negative, does NOT in any way reflect the attitude of the city as a whole. Even if an articicle had 200 comments all of which were negative and all from different people, it would still not make up the majority concensus of the population of the city... a lot of people don't comment because they think it's fine; in situations such as this, general human nature is to complain and want somebody to hear it - so people will come on here to complain, and it is most likely that every single person who disagrees with the scheme has put a comment on this website or written a letter; so all-in-all about 200 people disagree with the closure against the city population of hundreds of thousands of people.

And finally, if people are visiting York by car and then using the car to make silly little journeys just from Monk Bar to the NRM for example, then I personally think it's a good thing they won't be returning - they can go and create their own traffic jams elsewhere.
The number of logical fallacies in this post are almost astounding...

Do you genuinely think that all 200 people against the closure made it onto here? Wow, just wow....
[quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Igiveinthen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jonthan[/bold] wrote: "Merrett et al OUT" Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance. Hope you are OK with that[/p][/quote]Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?. To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.[/p][/quote]"The majority of commenters don't" The most any lendal bridge article has had is just under 200 comments, many being from the same people making different comments on the same article (or in the case of CHISSY, having an immature argument with somebody over about 10 or more posts)... Just because an article has 100-200 comments, the majority of which are negative, does NOT in any way reflect the attitude of the city as a whole. Even if an articicle had 200 comments all of which were negative and all from different people, it would still not make up the majority concensus of the population of the city... a lot of people don't comment because they think it's fine; in situations such as this, general human nature is to complain and want somebody to hear it - so people will come on here to complain, and it is most likely that every single person who disagrees with the scheme has put a comment on this website or written a letter; so all-in-all about 200 people disagree with the closure against the city population of hundreds of thousands of people. And finally, if people are visiting York by car and then using the car to make silly little journeys just from Monk Bar to the NRM for example, then I personally think it's a good thing they won't be returning - they can go and create their own traffic jams elsewhere.[/p][/quote]The number of logical fallacies in this post are almost astounding... Do you genuinely think that all 200 people against the closure made it onto here? Wow, just wow.... AGuyFromStrensall

11:29am Fri 3 Jan 14

mjgyork says...

As has been metioned (MANY) times before, most visitors would not know where Lendal bridge is. So no amount of sinage, even on the approaches to York, would be likely to make much difference. Clearly most of the anti closure comentators have either never visited another 'tourist' town such as Chester or they vote Tory. Probably both! Why shlould tourists be able to command every policy in York? If they want to drive into the city centre and do not do any research (like buying a map instead of being slaves to SatNav) TOUGH! The bridge is closed - GET USED TO IT!
As has been metioned (MANY) times before, most visitors would not know where Lendal bridge is. So no amount of sinage, even on the approaches to York, would be likely to make much difference. Clearly most of the anti closure comentators have either never visited another 'tourist' town such as Chester or they vote Tory. Probably both! Why shlould tourists be able to command every policy in York? If they want to drive into the city centre and do not do any research (like buying a map instead of being slaves to SatNav) TOUGH! The bridge is closed - GET USED TO IT! mjgyork

1:10pm Fri 3 Jan 14

WhyEver says...

MJG - the bridge is closed for another 8 weeks, yes. Can you tell me which map I can buy which shows the closure?

Magicman seems to be an able-bodied chap, who wants everyone else to do what he does.
MJG - the bridge is closed for another 8 weeks, yes. Can you tell me which map I can buy which shows the closure? Magicman seems to be an able-bodied chap, who wants everyone else to do what he does. WhyEver

4:05pm Fri 3 Jan 14

ak7274 says...

200 posters are passionate about their opposition to Lendal Bridge being closed.
Where are the passionate people who want Lendal bridge to remain closed?
Sorry Magic man that is only the first part of your argument that is flawed, how can any sane person now read your points of view with any sort of open mind?
For my part, I couldn't care less if the Bridge is closed, other than to pass on my belief that it could well be the death knell for business and tourism in the centre of a City I have grown up in and love.
200 posters are passionate about their opposition to Lendal Bridge being closed. Where are the passionate people who want Lendal bridge to remain closed? Sorry Magic man that is only the first part of your argument that is flawed, how can any sane person now read your points of view with any sort of open mind? For my part, I couldn't care less if the Bridge is closed, other than to pass on my belief that it could well be the death knell for business and tourism in the centre of a City I have grown up in and love. ak7274

4:51pm Fri 3 Jan 14

AGuyFromStrensall says...

ak7274 wrote:
200 posters are passionate about their opposition to Lendal Bridge being closed.
Where are the passionate people who want Lendal bridge to remain closed?
Sorry Magic man that is only the first part of your argument that is flawed, how can any sane person now read your points of view with any sort of open mind?
For my part, I couldn't care less if the Bridge is closed, other than to pass on my belief that it could well be the death knell for business and tourism in the centre of a City I have grown up in and love.
It's a fun game. Which of these does MagicMan's argument fall foul of:
http://en.wikipedia.
org/wiki/List_of_fal
lacies

I haven't spent time, but I bet it is 3+...
[quote][p][bold]ak7274[/bold] wrote: 200 posters are passionate about their opposition to Lendal Bridge being closed. Where are the passionate people who want Lendal bridge to remain closed? Sorry Magic man that is only the first part of your argument that is flawed, how can any sane person now read your points of view with any sort of open mind? For my part, I couldn't care less if the Bridge is closed, other than to pass on my belief that it could well be the death knell for business and tourism in the centre of a City I have grown up in and love.[/p][/quote]It's a fun game. Which of these does MagicMan's argument fall foul of: http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_fal lacies I haven't spent time, but I bet it is 3+... AGuyFromStrensall

4:54pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Igiveinthen says...

mjgyork wrote:
As has been metioned (MANY) times before, most visitors would not know where Lendal bridge is. So no amount of sinage, even on the approaches to York, would be likely to make much difference. Clearly most of the anti closure comentators have either never visited another 'tourist' town such as Chester or they vote Tory. Probably both! Why shlould tourists be able to command every policy in York? If they want to drive into the city centre and do not do any research (like buying a map instead of being slaves to SatNav) TOUGH! The bridge is closed - GET USED TO IT!
What a complete load of balderdash!
Do you think that every time one visits a strange town a visit to the bookshop to purchase a street map is required, you also don't know anything about using a satalite navigation aid, at least one doesn't have to take ones eyes off the road, why don't you buy one and find out, oh and in case you don't have a driving license you can also get one for a cycle, but no doubt you are such a clever person that you don't need one but rely on a map, which are out off date within a year, at least I get 4 updates per year, but as you may know as you are such a clever fellow, they don't take into account the changes made such as restricted access times over bridges, come to think of it nor do maps.
No I haven't visited Chester yet but I do vote Tory.
[quote][p][bold]mjgyork[/bold] wrote: As has been metioned (MANY) times before, most visitors would not know where Lendal bridge is. So no amount of sinage, even on the approaches to York, would be likely to make much difference. Clearly most of the anti closure comentators have either never visited another 'tourist' town such as Chester or they vote Tory. Probably both! Why shlould tourists be able to command every policy in York? If they want to drive into the city centre and do not do any research (like buying a map instead of being slaves to SatNav) TOUGH! The bridge is closed - GET USED TO IT![/p][/quote]What a complete load of balderdash! Do you think that every time one visits a strange town a visit to the bookshop to purchase a street map is required, you also don't know anything about using a satalite navigation aid, at least one doesn't have to take ones eyes off the road, why don't you buy one and find out, oh and in case you don't have a driving license you can also get one for a cycle, but no doubt you are such a clever person that you don't need one but rely on a map, which are out off date within a year, at least I get 4 updates per year, but as you may know as you are such a clever fellow, they don't take into account the changes made such as restricted access times over bridges, come to think of it nor do maps. No I haven't visited Chester yet but I do vote Tory. Igiveinthen

5:51pm Fri 3 Jan 14

hardlybelievable says...

Magicman! wrote:
hardlybelievable wrote:
The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.
"Labour - they nearly broke the country"... Well if labour NEARLY broke the country, then the Tories HAVE broken the country now.
and this is why we are where we are, Labour and Tory supporters throwing rocks; the politicians love this mentality and is distracts us from making the changes required.
The party you like is irrelevant, focus on the issue that need addressing
[quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hardlybelievable[/bold] wrote: The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.[/p][/quote]"Labour - they nearly broke the country"... Well if labour NEARLY broke the country, then the Tories HAVE broken the country now.[/p][/quote]and this is why we are where we are, Labour and Tory supporters throwing rocks; the politicians love this mentality and is distracts us from making the changes required. The party you like is irrelevant, focus on the issue that need addressing hardlybelievable

6:16pm Fri 3 Jan 14

Buzzz Light-year says...

hardlybelievable wrote:
Magicman! wrote:
hardlybelievable wrote:
The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.
"Labour - they nearly broke the country"... Well if labour NEARLY broke the country, then the Tories HAVE broken the country now.
and this is why we are where we are, Labour and Tory supporters throwing rocks; the politicians love this mentality and is distracts us from making the changes required.
The party you like is irrelevant, focus on the issue that need addressing
Excellent comment.
[quote][p][bold]hardlybelievable[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]hardlybelievable[/bold] wrote: The splendid 'York inner' residents have not yet been pulled down far enough yet to see that Labour that they keep electing are killing the City slowly, until they do nothing will change. Best advice for the next local election for the York Inner folks is vote anything you want except Labour; they nearly broke the country, they are doing the same to our city.[/p][/quote]"Labour - they nearly broke the country"... Well if labour NEARLY broke the country, then the Tories HAVE broken the country now.[/p][/quote]and this is why we are where we are, Labour and Tory supporters throwing rocks; the politicians love this mentality and is distracts us from making the changes required. The party you like is irrelevant, focus on the issue that need addressing[/p][/quote]Excellent comment. Buzzz Light-year

6:52pm Fri 3 Jan 14

anth!! says...

ColdAsChristmas wrote:
No 5 in the UK's Cr*p Towns list. Say no more.
Cant be talking about York, York is a city.
[quote][p][bold]ColdAsChristmas[/bold] wrote: No 5 in the UK's Cr*p Towns list. Say no more.[/p][/quote]Cant be talking about York, York is a city. anth!!

9:23pm Fri 3 Jan 14

anistasia says...

How many times have tourists/day trippers come to York and been caught out.how many have gone away vowing never to return.more people do this and tell other people won't come then shops will close and city centre will closeand the council revenue will drop so what other scheme will they come up with to make up the short fall some other nasty scheme.so we'll pay more in local taxes and have no services.
How many times have tourists/day trippers come to York and been caught out.how many have gone away vowing never to return.more people do this and tell other people won't come then shops will close and city centre will closeand the council revenue will drop so what other scheme will they come up with to make up the short fall some other nasty scheme.so we'll pay more in local taxes and have no services. anistasia

9:27pm Fri 3 Jan 14

ColdAsChristmas says...

And Hull came top on the previous edition. They are a City, soon to become Tigers! Oh and in this current edition, London came top. I don't suppose that would be the Capital City London, would it?
And Hull came top on the previous edition. They are a City, soon to become Tigers! Oh and in this current edition, London came top. I don't suppose that would be the Capital City London, would it? ColdAsChristmas

4:28am Sat 4 Jan 14

Magicman! says...

Igiveinthen wrote:
Magicman! says..., I take it from your comment you are in favour of the bridge restrictions, and you try to put a case that the majority of York residents are in favour of it as well, you also come across as an anti-car subscriber, an attitude can't quite understand, people have choices and irrespective of what I or you think will make their own decisions on their mode of transport.
The point of the argument that I am making is that there is something radically wrong with the way this bridge restriction has been handled, and I am convinced that c30,0000 drivers cannot all be wrong or cavalier in their attitude to this restricted access issue.
I have witnessed two instances where the car in front of me was hesitant as to which lane to use, both instances where since the matrix sign was installed, I managed to prevent one driver crossing but unfortunately the other was too quick for me and went across, adding to the cash flow of the council coffers.
My view is for the bridge closure, BUT with suitable improvements to surrounding roads and junctions including the A1237 so that people can still get around.
What I am against is POINTLESS car journeys... a letter recently in the press was of a bloke who got in the car and drove from Monkbar Hotel to the National Railay Museum - that journey was pointless, and could have been done by walking and/or using the bus/road train. It is journeys like these that clog up the roads for everybody who actually has a NEED to drive... likewise with parents who live on the route of a bus service to the school their kid goes to, and yet they drive their kid to the school - pointless.

Yes people have choices, but York's road network is close to absolute saturation - if everybody made the choice they wanted to make (nice warm sheltered tin box on wheels with leather seats) then it'd take hours to make any journey - just a simple journey such as Layerthorpe to Blossom Street would take over an hour, compared to maximum 30 minutes walking it.

Yes, people have choices, but sometimes the wise choice is to think of other people and not just yourself.
[quote][p][bold]Igiveinthen[/bold] wrote: Magicman! says..., I take it from your comment you are in favour of the bridge restrictions, and you try to put a case that the majority of York residents are in favour of it as well, you also come across as an anti-car subscriber, an attitude can't quite understand, people have choices and irrespective of what I or you think will make their own decisions on their mode of transport. The point of the argument that I am making is that there is something radically wrong with the way this bridge restriction has been handled, and I am convinced that c30,0000 drivers cannot all be wrong or cavalier in their attitude to this restricted access issue. I have witnessed two instances where the car in front of me was hesitant as to which lane to use, both instances where since the matrix sign was installed, I managed to prevent one driver crossing but unfortunately the other was too quick for me and went across, adding to the cash flow of the council coffers.[/p][/quote]My view is for the bridge closure, BUT with suitable improvements to surrounding roads and junctions including the A1237 so that people can still get around. What I am against is POINTLESS car journeys... a letter recently in the press was of a bloke who got in the car and drove from Monkbar Hotel to the National Railay Museum - that journey was pointless, and could have been done by walking and/or using the bus/road train. It is journeys like these that clog up the roads for everybody who actually has a NEED to drive... likewise with parents who live on the route of a bus service to the school their kid goes to, and yet they drive their kid to the school - pointless. Yes people have choices, but York's road network is close to absolute saturation - if everybody made the choice they wanted to make (nice warm sheltered tin box on wheels with leather seats) then it'd take hours to make any journey - just a simple journey such as Layerthorpe to Blossom Street would take over an hour, compared to maximum 30 minutes walking it. Yes, people have choices, but sometimes the wise choice is to think of other people and not just yourself. Magicman!

4:32am Sat 4 Jan 14

Magicman! says...

AGuyFromStrensall wrote:
Magicman! wrote:
Igiveinthen wrote:
Jonthan wrote:
"Merrett et al OUT"

Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance.
Hope you are OK with that
Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?.
To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.
"The majority of commenters don't"

The most any lendal bridge article has had is just under 200 comments, many being from the same people making different comments on the same article (or in the case of CHISSY, having an immature argument with somebody over about 10 or more posts)... Just because an article has 100-200 comments, the majority of which are negative, does NOT in any way reflect the attitude of the city as a whole. Even if an articicle had 200 comments all of which were negative and all from different people, it would still not make up the majority concensus of the population of the city... a lot of people don't comment because they think it's fine; in situations such as this, general human nature is to complain and want somebody to hear it - so people will come on here to complain, and it is most likely that every single person who disagrees with the scheme has put a comment on this website or written a letter; so all-in-all about 200 people disagree with the closure against the city population of hundreds of thousands of people.

And finally, if people are visiting York by car and then using the car to make silly little journeys just from Monk Bar to the NRM for example, then I personally think it's a good thing they won't be returning - they can go and create their own traffic jams elsewhere.
The number of logical fallacies in this post are almost astounding...

Do you genuinely think that all 200 people against the closure made it onto here? Wow, just wow....
Well sure as hell isn't going to be 50,000 people who dislike the closure and cannot access a computer or this website. Another 100 people, perhaps, but the simple fact is that MOST who hate this closure will have made their feelings known in one way or another by know, and the numbers don't add up to be anywhere near the population of this city within its boundaries.

Plus you say "the number of logical fallacies in this post are almost astounding", and yet only pick one. Hyperbole alert!!
[quote][p][bold]AGuyFromStrensall[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Igiveinthen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jonthan[/bold] wrote: "Merrett et al OUT" Hmmm ! Are you a betting person Kevlar? Dave Merrett got 1873 votes last time, more than twice as many as the nearest conservative. However the Greens did well with with 1094 votes. so your prediction is right, Micklegate ward is likely to go Green, but the Tories have no chance. Hope you are OK with that[/p][/quote]Having read many letters where the council have been criticised, and have noticed in the majority of cases that you appear to defend them, you obviously think that the Lendal Bridge restrictions are a good thing, whilst it appears the majority of the commenters don't, do you work for the council? or are you a buddy of councillor Merrett?. To continue the original thread I agree it is an appalling greeting visitors get when they fall foul of the bridge restrictions and the number of PCN's issued is unbelievable, something needs to be done as it's making York a place that people will not want to return to.[/p][/quote]"The majority of commenters don't" The most any lendal bridge article has had is just under 200 comments, many being from the same people making different comments on the same article (or in the case of CHISSY, having an immature argument with somebody over about 10 or more posts)... Just because an article has 100-200 comments, the majority of which are negative, does NOT in any way reflect the attitude of the city as a whole. Even if an articicle had 200 comments all of which were negative and all from different people, it would still not make up the majority concensus of the population of the city... a lot of people don't comment because they think it's fine; in situations such as this, general human nature is to complain and want somebody to hear it - so people will come on here to complain, and it is most likely that every single person who disagrees with the scheme has put a comment on this website or written a letter; so all-in-all about 200 people disagree with the closure against the city population of hundreds of thousands of people. And finally, if people are visiting York by car and then using the car to make silly little journeys just from Monk Bar to the NRM for example, then I personally think it's a good thing they won't be returning - they can go and create their own traffic jams elsewhere.[/p][/quote]The number of logical fallacies in this post are almost astounding... Do you genuinely think that all 200 people against the closure made it onto here? Wow, just wow....[/p][/quote]Well sure as hell isn't going to be 50,000 people who dislike the closure and cannot access a computer or this website. Another 100 people, perhaps, but the simple fact is that MOST who hate this closure will have made their feelings known in one way or another by know, and the numbers don't add up to be anywhere near the population of this city within its boundaries. Plus you say "the number of logical fallacies in this post are almost astounding", and yet only pick one. Hyperbole alert!! Magicman!

4:36am Sat 4 Jan 14

Magicman! says...

AGuyFromStrensall wrote:
ak7274 wrote:
200 posters are passionate about their opposition to Lendal Bridge being closed.
Where are the passionate people who want Lendal bridge to remain closed?
Sorry Magic man that is only the first part of your argument that is flawed, how can any sane person now read your points of view with any sort of open mind?
For my part, I couldn't care less if the Bridge is closed, other than to pass on my belief that it could well be the death knell for business and tourism in the centre of a City I have grown up in and love.
It's a fun game. Which of these does MagicMan's argument fall foul of:
http://en.wikipedia.

org/wiki/List_of_fal

lacies

I haven't spent time, but I bet it is 3+...
"I haven't spent time, but I bet..."

and using wikipedia as your source.

Oh you've made me laugh, thank you!!

If you're going to critisice what I have written, at least do some research about it first so you actually have a leg to stand on.
[quote][p][bold]AGuyFromStrensall[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]ak7274[/bold] wrote: 200 posters are passionate about their opposition to Lendal Bridge being closed. Where are the passionate people who want Lendal bridge to remain closed? Sorry Magic man that is only the first part of your argument that is flawed, how can any sane person now read your points of view with any sort of open mind? For my part, I couldn't care less if the Bridge is closed, other than to pass on my belief that it could well be the death knell for business and tourism in the centre of a City I have grown up in and love.[/p][/quote]It's a fun game. Which of these does MagicMan's argument fall foul of: http://en.wikipedia. org/wiki/List_of_fal lacies I haven't spent time, but I bet it is 3+...[/p][/quote]"I haven't spent time, but I bet..." and using wikipedia as your source. Oh you've made me laugh, thank you!! If you're going to critisice what I have written, at least do some research about it first so you actually have a leg to stand on. Magicman!

11:53am Sat 4 Jan 14

Igiveinthen says...

Magicman! wrote:
Igiveinthen wrote:
Magicman! says..., I take it from your comment you are in favour of the bridge restrictions, and you try to put a case that the majority of York residents are in favour of it as well, you also come across as an anti-car subscriber, an attitude can't quite understand, people have choices and irrespective of what I or you think will make their own decisions on their mode of transport.
The point of the argument that I am making is that there is something radically wrong with the way this bridge restriction has been handled, and I am convinced that c30,0000 drivers cannot all be wrong or cavalier in their attitude to this restricted access issue.
I have witnessed two instances where the car in front of me was hesitant as to which lane to use, both instances where since the matrix sign was installed, I managed to prevent one driver crossing but unfortunately the other was too quick for me and went across, adding to the cash flow of the council coffers.
My view is for the bridge closure, BUT with suitable improvements to surrounding roads and junctions including the A1237 so that people can still get around.
What I am against is POINTLESS car journeys... a letter recently in the press was of a bloke who got in the car and drove from Monkbar Hotel to the National Railay Museum - that journey was pointless, and could have been done by walking and/or using the bus/road train. It is journeys like these that clog up the roads for everybody who actually has a NEED to drive... likewise with parents who live on the route of a bus service to the school their kid goes to, and yet they drive their kid to the school - pointless.

Yes people have choices, but York's road network is close to absolute saturation - if everybody made the choice they wanted to make (nice warm sheltered tin box on wheels with leather seats) then it'd take hours to make any journey - just a simple journey such as Layerthorpe to Blossom Street would take over an hour, compared to maximum 30 minutes walking it.

Yes, people have choices, but sometimes the wise choice is to think of other people and not just yourself.
In principal I am in agreement with your comments, I would have thought myself that the Hotel would have informed the family who travelled from Monkbar to the Railway Museum that there was a road train from Exhibition Square or as you say thet could have walked through some wonderful medieval streets, maybe those Hotels close to the city centre and even on the outskirts should offer travel advice?
I am not completly against the bridge restrictions, as I have stated before I find it difficult to understand how the unbelievable high number of PCN's issued continues, and in my opinion it should trigger a review by an independent body, if one exists.
To me it's the outer ring roads that need looking at, I live on Fishergate so if I need to go into town I walk, but if I need to go to Monks Cross for example I go out on the A19 and join the A64 and travel that way round the city rather than go through town, so if they could be upgraded I am sure that it would take a lot of the traffic out of the city, but the down side is that peddallingpaul will come back with the 'induced effect' theory, so you can't win either way!
By the way you nearly got my car description right, you omitted the automatic gear box! (said tonge in cheek).
[quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Igiveinthen[/bold] wrote: Magicman! says..., I take it from your comment you are in favour of the bridge restrictions, and you try to put a case that the majority of York residents are in favour of it as well, you also come across as an anti-car subscriber, an attitude can't quite understand, people have choices and irrespective of what I or you think will make their own decisions on their mode of transport. The point of the argument that I am making is that there is something radically wrong with the way this bridge restriction has been handled, and I am convinced that c30,0000 drivers cannot all be wrong or cavalier in their attitude to this restricted access issue. I have witnessed two instances where the car in front of me was hesitant as to which lane to use, both instances where since the matrix sign was installed, I managed to prevent one driver crossing but unfortunately the other was too quick for me and went across, adding to the cash flow of the council coffers.[/p][/quote]My view is for the bridge closure, BUT with suitable improvements to surrounding roads and junctions including the A1237 so that people can still get around. What I am against is POINTLESS car journeys... a letter recently in the press was of a bloke who got in the car and drove from Monkbar Hotel to the National Railay Museum - that journey was pointless, and could have been done by walking and/or using the bus/road train. It is journeys like these that clog up the roads for everybody who actually has a NEED to drive... likewise with parents who live on the route of a bus service to the school their kid goes to, and yet they drive their kid to the school - pointless. Yes people have choices, but York's road network is close to absolute saturation - if everybody made the choice they wanted to make (nice warm sheltered tin box on wheels with leather seats) then it'd take hours to make any journey - just a simple journey such as Layerthorpe to Blossom Street would take over an hour, compared to maximum 30 minutes walking it. Yes, people have choices, but sometimes the wise choice is to think of other people and not just yourself.[/p][/quote]In principal I am in agreement with your comments, I would have thought myself that the Hotel would have informed the family who travelled from Monkbar to the Railway Museum that there was a road train from Exhibition Square or as you say thet could have walked through some wonderful medieval streets, maybe those Hotels close to the city centre and even on the outskirts should offer travel advice? I am not completly against the bridge restrictions, as I have stated before I find it difficult to understand how the unbelievable high number of PCN's issued continues, and in my opinion it should trigger a review by an independent body, if one exists. To me it's the outer ring roads that need looking at, I live on Fishergate so if I need to go into town I walk, but if I need to go to Monks Cross for example I go out on the A19 and join the A64 and travel that way round the city rather than go through town, so if they could be upgraded I am sure that it would take a lot of the traffic out of the city, but the down side is that peddallingpaul will come back with the 'induced effect' theory, so you can't win either way! By the way you nearly got my car description right, you omitted the automatic gear box! (said tonge in cheek). Igiveinthen

9:29pm Sat 4 Jan 14

ouseswimmer says...

The signage is no longer an issue. If drivers ignore two signs at the same height on either side of the road which clearly state no motor vehicles ie round sign with the flying motorbike over a car. Below each signs is the time restriction then they rightly deserve a fine. They also should read the highway code.
The signage is no longer an issue. If drivers ignore two signs at the same height on either side of the road which clearly state no motor vehicles ie round sign with the flying motorbike over a car. Below each signs is the time restriction then they rightly deserve a fine. They also should read the highway code. ouseswimmer

7:09pm Sun 5 Jan 14

jacaranda says...

Just spent a few days in York. First visit since Lendal Bridge restricted access was introduced. What a mess, the alternative routes were almost gridlocked every time I tried to go from one side of the city to the other. Pollution and travel time definitely increased. So where is the benefit and to who?
Just spent a few days in York. First visit since Lendal Bridge restricted access was introduced. What a mess, the alternative routes were almost gridlocked every time I tried to go from one side of the city to the other. Pollution and travel time definitely increased. So where is the benefit and to who? jacaranda

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