Free parking plan for York city centre slammed by opposition councillors

York Press: Shoppers will be able to park for free between 8am and 11am on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays, under the new plan. Shoppers will be able to park for free between 8am and 11am on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays, under the new plan.

A SCHEME to provide free parking in York city centre will lead to more congestion at peak times, opposition councillors have claimed.

The Greens and Liberal Democrats also say money for the project is being diverted from important measures to ease congestion in the area around the new John Lewis store at Monks Cross, and have called it in for further scrutiny.

City of York Council announced earlier this month that drivers will be able to park in eight council-owned car parks for free between 8am and 11am on Thursdays, Fridays and Saturdays, under new plans to boost the city centre.

The move, which came just days after the council abandoned the controversial traffic ban on Lendal Bridge, was welcomed by retailers.

But opposition councillors said yesterday that while support for city centre businesses in the face of competition from the new John Lewis store at Monks Cross was welcome, the Labour administration's proposal was 'ill thought out' and would encourage more traffic on congested roads at peak times.

They also said the public should be told which measures to ease traffic congestion around the new stores would not now be provided if the money was being diverted to fund free parking, which is due to start on May 26.

Green Cllr Andy D'Agorne said "Highway officers have made clear that the limited funding for traffic mitigation around the new stores will only be spent on measure which are 'evidence based and carefully considered', yet (council leader) James Alexander is happy to take a chance on this plan with no evidence to show it is the most effective way to boost city centre trade."

But Cllr Alexander said Labour had listened to residents and businesses and had been working in partnership to introduce the free parking pilot scheme for at least six months.

"It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite," he said.

"They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green and were critical of us trying to remove the purple of ftr bus off our streets after how much money they had wasted on both schemes when they ran the council."

Comments (31)

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9:14am Tue 29 Apr 14

york_chap says...

"The Greens and Liberal Democrats also say money for the project is being diverted from important measures to ease congestion in the area around the new John Lewis store at Monks Cross"

As much as I don't generally agree with most schemes the council tried since it came into office; surely the very point of this scheme is to encourage people back into the city centre; trade that is currently being lost to the out of town centres. Spending money to make it easier still to visit monks cross is hardly going to help the city centre.
"The Greens and Liberal Democrats also say money for the project is being diverted from important measures to ease congestion in the area around the new John Lewis store at Monks Cross" As much as I don't generally agree with most schemes the council tried since it came into office; surely the very point of this scheme is to encourage people back into the city centre; trade that is currently being lost to the out of town centres. Spending money to make it easier still to visit monks cross is hardly going to help the city centre. york_chap
  • Score: 12

9:19am Tue 29 Apr 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

Cllr Alexander said.
"It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite,".

Totally sums up the attitude of York Labour, the response would be acceptable in a kindergarten but not the grown up world of local politics.

Seems the Leader is incapable of rationalising his actions with a response based on a calculated evidentially based actions.

I would not have been surprised to see an answer of my dads bigger than your dad or I'm going to get you outside the gates.

Unbelievable.

Go get your gang of Mark-Down Mongrels to even things up.
Cllr Alexander said. "It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite,". Totally sums up the attitude of York Labour, the response would be acceptable in a kindergarten but not the grown up world of local politics. Seems the Leader is incapable of rationalising his actions with a response based on a calculated evidentially based actions. I would not have been surprised to see an answer of my dads bigger than your dad or I'm going to get you outside the gates. Unbelievable. Go get your gang of Mark-Down Mongrels to even things up. YOUWILLDOASISAY
  • Score: -20

9:21am Tue 29 Apr 14

The Great Buda says...

This story shows all that is wrong with politics in this country. It also shows why fruit loops like UKIP are gaining support.
This story shows all that is wrong with politics in this country. It also shows why fruit loops like UKIP are gaining support. The Great Buda
  • Score: 28

9:24am Tue 29 Apr 14

P3TER1 says...

Why not provide free parking between 10:00 - 13:00?
Why not provide free parking between 10:00 - 13:00? P3TER1
  • Score: -3

9:42am Tue 29 Apr 14

the original Homer says...

JA is just trying to make this out as being political games to deflect from the fact he can't produce any reasoning behind the scheme.

The opposition Councillors have (belatedly) picked up on the things raised on this site when the scheme was announced, i.e it increases congestion by encouraging cars into the wrong place at the wrong time.

No use saying you've "listened to residents and businesses" JA, because if you really had, you'd have been announcing a scheme based around P&R not around free parking.
JA is just trying to make this out as being political games to deflect from the fact he can't produce any reasoning behind the scheme. The opposition Councillors have (belatedly) picked up on the things raised on this site when the scheme was announced, i.e it increases congestion by encouraging cars into the wrong place at the wrong time. No use saying you've "listened to residents and businesses" JA, because if you really had, you'd have been announcing a scheme based around P&R not around free parking. the original Homer
  • Score: -15

9:53am Tue 29 Apr 14

Garrowby Turnoff says...

The naysayers are staring into the mouth of a gift horse they don't deserve. Don't have free parking then! Sheesh!
The naysayers are staring into the mouth of a gift horse they don't deserve. Don't have free parking then! Sheesh! Garrowby Turnoff
  • Score: 38

10:13am Tue 29 Apr 14

Big Bad Wolf says...

The only downside in this is the timings.
Not many shops are trading at 8am and the potential to miss the 11am deadline is massive!!
The only downside in this is the timings. Not many shops are trading at 8am and the potential to miss the 11am deadline is massive!! Big Bad Wolf
  • Score: -21

10:23am Tue 29 Apr 14

YOUWILLDOASISAY says...

P3TER1 wrote:
Why not provide free parking between 10:00 - 13:00?
Because if you suggest anything other than the what has been dictated by Labour you would be accused of thinking you know best and being full of political spite.

It seems political spite and believing they know best is closer to home for Labour than they would care to admit. Unfortunately the weakness they demonstrate through ultimatum results in diminished benefits for residents.

Weak leadership seems to go hand in hand with personal promotion, it has to be about me or nothing.
[quote][p][bold]P3TER1[/bold] wrote: Why not provide free parking between 10:00 - 13:00?[/p][/quote]Because if you suggest anything other than the what has been dictated by Labour you would be accused of thinking you know best and being full of political spite. It seems political spite and believing they know best is closer to home for Labour than they would care to admit. Unfortunately the weakness they demonstrate through ultimatum results in diminished benefits for residents. Weak leadership seems to go hand in hand with personal promotion, it has to be about me or nothing. YOUWILLDOASISAY
  • Score: -19

10:33am Tue 29 Apr 14

imassey says...

the original Homer wrote:
JA is just trying to make this out as being political games to deflect from the fact he can't produce any reasoning behind the scheme.

The opposition Councillors have (belatedly) picked up on the things raised on this site when the scheme was announced, i.e it increases congestion by encouraging cars into the wrong place at the wrong time.

No use saying you've "listened to residents and businesses" JA, because if you really had, you'd have been announcing a scheme based around P&R not around free parking.
Except that nearly everybody who complains about parking prices/not being able to get over Lendal Bridge/too many cyclists blocking the roads, also says that they don't want to use buses because they don't go to where they want to go/from where they want to start/are unreliable/they can't carry their shopping on them.

Face it, those who want to drive into the centre won't use Park and Ride for the same reasons. They would still be able to use their cars but would then have to share public transport with the great unwashed and would struggle to carry their shopping.

Personally, I think free parking is a good idea for those who want to use it but, as has been said, the timings are wrong. Presumably the 08:00 start has been decided so that those whose little darlings can't walk to school can go straight into town after dropping them off...

..then wait for an hour or so while the shops open. So, for three hours free parking you actually get less than two hours shopping time. It would be better to have a full day available on Wednesdays and Thursdays (in my humble opinion).
[quote][p][bold]the original Homer[/bold] wrote: JA is just trying to make this out as being political games to deflect from the fact he can't produce any reasoning behind the scheme. The opposition Councillors have (belatedly) picked up on the things raised on this site when the scheme was announced, i.e it increases congestion by encouraging cars into the wrong place at the wrong time. No use saying you've "listened to residents and businesses" JA, because if you really had, you'd have been announcing a scheme based around P&R not around free parking.[/p][/quote]Except that nearly everybody who complains about parking prices/not being able to get over Lendal Bridge/too many cyclists blocking the roads, also says that they don't want to use buses because they don't go to where they want to go/from where they want to start/are unreliable/they can't carry their shopping on them. Face it, those who want to drive into the centre won't use Park and Ride for the same reasons. They would still be able to use their cars but would then have to share public transport with the great unwashed and would struggle to carry their shopping. Personally, I think free parking is a good idea for those who want to use it but, as has been said, the timings are wrong. Presumably the 08:00 start has been decided so that those whose little darlings can't walk to school can go straight into town after dropping them off... ..then wait for an hour or so while the shops open. So, for three hours free parking you actually get less than two hours shopping time. It would be better to have a full day available on Wednesdays and Thursdays (in my humble opinion). imassey
  • Score: -1

11:12am Tue 29 Apr 14

X5019c says...

The Great Buda wrote:
This story shows all that is wrong with politics in this country. It also shows why fruit loops like UKIP are gaining support.
Voting UKIP is probably the last chance we have have of regaining control of our Country. Oh, and before you label me a racist (which seems to be the favoured response to UKIP supporters I would like to suggest that 'Racist' and derivative terms are not used in any descriptive sense.they are now purely linguistic weapons of social control.
[quote][p][bold]The Great Buda[/bold] wrote: This story shows all that is wrong with politics in this country. It also shows why fruit loops like UKIP are gaining support.[/p][/quote]Voting UKIP is probably the last chance we have have of regaining control of our Country. Oh, and before you label me a racist (which seems to be the favoured response to UKIP supporters I would like to suggest that 'Racist' and derivative terms are not used in any descriptive sense.they are now purely linguistic weapons of social control. X5019c
  • Score: -47

11:14am Tue 29 Apr 14

Older Sometimes Wiser says...

Can anyone please let me know whether the Residents FREE PARKING CONCESSION in City Centre Car parks after 6pm has been removed.
This was threatened but I haven't seen any formal statement on this.
Many thanks.
Can anyone please let me know whether the Residents FREE PARKING CONCESSION in City Centre Car parks after 6pm has been removed. This was threatened but I haven't seen any formal statement on this. Many thanks. Older Sometimes Wiser
  • Score: 13

11:16am Tue 29 Apr 14

bolero says...

Politics is just a game and a dirty one at that. It is nothing but a massive ego trip and and all expenses paid as well. Whilst the timings for free parking are so obviously wrong; because JA needs his ears syringing if this is supposed to be in answer to what he's been told; what are the alternatives that the opposition consider are the answer? Or is it just more of the usual Blah,Blah,Blah because we have to think of something during the twelve months leading up to the next election. Some choice I must say. As the advert used to say "Give us a bag of crisps".
Politics is just a game and a dirty one at that. It is nothing but a massive ego trip and and all expenses paid as well. Whilst the timings for free parking are so obviously wrong; because JA needs his ears syringing if this is supposed to be in answer to what he's been told; what are the alternatives that the opposition consider are the answer? Or is it just more of the usual Blah,Blah,Blah because we have to think of something during the twelve months leading up to the next election. Some choice I must say. As the advert used to say "Give us a bag of crisps". bolero
  • Score: -37

11:24am Tue 29 Apr 14

the original Homer says...

bolero wrote:
Politics is just a game and a dirty one at that. It is nothing but a massive ego trip and and all expenses paid as well. Whilst the timings for free parking are so obviously wrong; because JA needs his ears syringing if this is supposed to be in answer to what he's been told; what are the alternatives that the opposition consider are the answer? Or is it just more of the usual Blah,Blah,Blah because we have to think of something during the twelve months leading up to the next election. Some choice I must say. As the advert used to say "Give us a bag of crisps".
We may want crisps, but all we're being offered is nuts!
[quote][p][bold]bolero[/bold] wrote: Politics is just a game and a dirty one at that. It is nothing but a massive ego trip and and all expenses paid as well. Whilst the timings for free parking are so obviously wrong; because JA needs his ears syringing if this is supposed to be in answer to what he's been told; what are the alternatives that the opposition consider are the answer? Or is it just more of the usual Blah,Blah,Blah because we have to think of something during the twelve months leading up to the next election. Some choice I must say. As the advert used to say "Give us a bag of crisps".[/p][/quote]We may want crisps, but all we're being offered is nuts! the original Homer
  • Score: -31

11:28am Tue 29 Apr 14

yorkshirelad says...

The whole story is more about politics than anything else. Let's face it, councils can't do right for doing wrong these days. We elect them and then attack them. But while York plays political games with transport, we fall behind other cities. Wolf-whistle politics should have no place in transport because all the solutions required in the long run are initially unpopular. But hey-ho, here we go...an election approaching...

It would be so much better for York if the local paper could promote sensible, rational, respectful debate rather than screaming headlines getting everyone boiling with rage over nothing.
The whole story is more about politics than anything else. Let's face it, councils can't do right for doing wrong these days. We elect them and then attack them. But while York plays political games with transport, we fall behind other cities. Wolf-whistle politics should have no place in transport because all the solutions required in the long run are initially unpopular. But hey-ho, here we go...an election approaching... It would be so much better for York if the local paper could promote sensible, rational, respectful debate rather than screaming headlines getting everyone boiling with rage over nothing. yorkshirelad
  • Score: 0

12:23pm Tue 29 Apr 14

Caecilius says...

"They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green ...."

To stop you ripping out the cycle lane, you mean, thus destroying part of the orbital cycle route at the same time you were boasting about the work you were doing towards completing it. Carried out a consultation exercise on that, didn't you, Alexander? Care to remind us what the results were, and how you ignored them (along with the report compiled by Council officers and the opinion of all three emergency services) so you could grovel to the pro-car lobby for its support? Maybe you could tell us how you came to claim in a radio interview that your manifesto had included a promise to remove the cycle lane, when no such promise was to be found in the document? Or perhaps you'ld prefer to explain why your actions at Clifton Green had no effect on congestion except to redistribute it onto the other roads feeding the junction, just as you were told they would, and why your new transport spokesman is now talking about changing the timing of the lights, again, in another futile piece of vote-grubbing gesture politics.
"They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green ...." To stop you ripping out the cycle lane, you mean, thus destroying part of the orbital cycle route at the same time you were boasting about the work you were doing towards completing it. Carried out a consultation exercise on that, didn't you, Alexander? Care to remind us what the results were, and how you ignored them (along with the report compiled by Council officers and the opinion of all three emergency services) so you could grovel to the pro-car lobby for its support? Maybe you could tell us how you came to claim in a radio interview that your manifesto had included a promise to remove the cycle lane, when no such promise was to be found in the document? Or perhaps you'ld prefer to explain why your actions at Clifton Green had no effect on congestion except to redistribute it onto the other roads feeding the junction, just as you were told they would, and why your new transport spokesman is now talking about changing the timing of the lights, again, in another futile piece of vote-grubbing gesture politics. Caecilius
  • Score: 35

1:01pm Tue 29 Apr 14

Funnyian says...

Are one or two people missing the point? 11am comes and i wonder how many traffic wardens will be already in the car park to issue tickets to the people who forget to return? another cash cow?
Are one or two people missing the point? 11am comes and i wonder how many traffic wardens will be already in the car park to issue tickets to the people who forget to return? another cash cow? Funnyian
  • Score: -28

2:57pm Tue 29 Apr 14

PKH says...

The timing of the free parking is madness, shops get deliveries up to 10:30am, so this increases the amount of pedestrians milling about with delivery vehicles, far from ideal.
The timing of the free parking is madness, shops get deliveries up to 10:30am, so this increases the amount of pedestrians milling about with delivery vehicles, far from ideal. PKH
  • Score: -36

3:17pm Tue 29 Apr 14

Badgers Drift says...

P3TER1 wrote:
Why not provide free parking between 10:00 - 13:00?
Why not all day for two full days, mid-week ?
[quote][p][bold]P3TER1[/bold] wrote: Why not provide free parking between 10:00 - 13:00?[/p][/quote]Why not all day for two full days, mid-week ? Badgers Drift
  • Score: -38

3:23pm Tue 29 Apr 14

yorkiemum says...

Caecilius wrote:
"They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green ...."

To stop you ripping out the cycle lane, you mean, thus destroying part of the orbital cycle route at the same time you were boasting about the work you were doing towards completing it. Carried out a consultation exercise on that, didn't you, Alexander? Care to remind us what the results were, and how you ignored them (along with the report compiled by Council officers and the opinion of all three emergency services) so you could grovel to the pro-car lobby for its support? Maybe you could tell us how you came to claim in a radio interview that your manifesto had included a promise to remove the cycle lane, when no such promise was to be found in the document? Or perhaps you'ld prefer to explain why your actions at Clifton Green had no effect on congestion except to redistribute it onto the other roads feeding the junction, just as you were told they would, and why your new transport spokesman is now talking about changing the timing of the lights, again, in another futile piece of vote-grubbing gesture politics.
Oh for goodness sake change the record. Clifton Green cycle lane thankfully has been removed get over it, move on and keep your nasty comments to yourself.
[quote][p][bold]Caecilius[/bold] wrote: "They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green ...." To stop you ripping out the cycle lane, you mean, thus destroying part of the orbital cycle route at the same time you were boasting about the work you were doing towards completing it. Carried out a consultation exercise on that, didn't you, Alexander? Care to remind us what the results were, and how you ignored them (along with the report compiled by Council officers and the opinion of all three emergency services) so you could grovel to the pro-car lobby for its support? Maybe you could tell us how you came to claim in a radio interview that your manifesto had included a promise to remove the cycle lane, when no such promise was to be found in the document? Or perhaps you'ld prefer to explain why your actions at Clifton Green had no effect on congestion except to redistribute it onto the other roads feeding the junction, just as you were told they would, and why your new transport spokesman is now talking about changing the timing of the lights, again, in another futile piece of vote-grubbing gesture politics.[/p][/quote]Oh for goodness sake change the record. Clifton Green cycle lane thankfully has been removed get over it, move on and keep your nasty comments to yourself. yorkiemum
  • Score: 9

3:54pm Tue 29 Apr 14

the original Homer says...

Funnyian wrote:
Are one or two people missing the point? 11am comes and i wonder how many traffic wardens will be already in the car park to issue tickets to the people who forget to return? another cash cow?
Is that really the point then? - The reason for introducing free parking is to entrap people into overstaying?

I agree it would mean lots of cars all had the same deadline, so it might seem a good time for a "warden" to be hanging around.

I don't see how making the parking free makes it any more likely that someone would forget to return though. You could even argue that it would be less likely, as the expiry time would be exactly 11:00, which is easier to remember than a time based on whatever time they happened to buy a ticket.

So there would be lots of drivers due to leave before 11, but a reduced chance of any of them forgetting. Not really the duck shooting season you seemed to be implying.

Anyway that's just detail. The real point is that the Council see this as a sweetener for traders and a way of appeasing voters, but they are doing it badly. On the one hand they will help traders, but they will increase congestion / pollution, and upset more voters than they appease.

Personally I would prefer free P&R over free parking, and I appreciate some have the opposite view. However, if the aims are to attract shoppers AND to reduce congestion / pollution, then the P&R idea works.

If free parking increases the number of shoppers then it must by definition increase the number of cars coming into the City. Free P&R would increase the number of shoppers and probably reduce the number of cars (at very worst it would leave them unchanged).

However, based on the bridge fiasco, we can expect the Council to discard this reasoning for now, and then be suddenly enlightened in about 6 months time.

With that in mind, I've written the press release for November:

"Our policy has always been to listen closely to public feedback, and to make changes in line with our stated intent to reduce congestion. With Christmas now approaching the highly successful free parking scheme will therefore be suspended in favour of free P&R throughout December"
[quote][p][bold]Funnyian[/bold] wrote: Are one or two people missing the point? 11am comes and i wonder how many traffic wardens will be already in the car park to issue tickets to the people who forget to return? another cash cow?[/p][/quote]Is that really the point then? - The reason for introducing free parking is to entrap people into overstaying? I agree it would mean lots of cars all had the same deadline, so it might seem a good time for a "warden" to be hanging around. I don't see how making the parking free makes it any more likely that someone would forget to return though. You could even argue that it would be less likely, as the expiry time would be exactly 11:00, which is easier to remember than a time based on whatever time they happened to buy a ticket. So there would be lots of drivers due to leave before 11, but a reduced chance of any of them forgetting. Not really the duck shooting season you seemed to be implying. Anyway that's just detail. The real point is that the Council see this as a sweetener for traders and a way of appeasing voters, but they are doing it badly. On the one hand they will help traders, but they will increase congestion / pollution, and upset more voters than they appease. Personally I would prefer free P&R over free parking, and I appreciate some have the opposite view. However, if the aims are to attract shoppers AND to reduce congestion / pollution, then the P&R idea works. If free parking increases the number of shoppers then it must by definition increase the number of cars coming into the City. Free P&R would increase the number of shoppers and probably reduce the number of cars (at very worst it would leave them unchanged). However, based on the bridge fiasco, we can expect the Council to discard this reasoning for now, and then be suddenly enlightened in about 6 months time. With that in mind, I've written the press release for November: "Our policy has always been to listen closely to public feedback, and to make changes in line with our stated intent to reduce congestion. With Christmas now approaching the highly successful free parking scheme will therefore be suspended in favour of free P&R throughout December" the original Homer
  • Score: 9

4:37pm Tue 29 Apr 14

York2000 says...

@yorkshirelad - Finally someone talking sense.

Sadly, the Press word articles to get a reaction, and this will not change even if there is a change of council leaders in 2015 - The Press have realised inviting division, insults, arguing and at times hatred drives traffic to their website.

That is not to say the council are not to blame for people's anger. At times they are. But it's turned into a circus. The Conservatives, LibDems, Greens and Labour will attack each other forever more, you can bet things will be exactly the same if Labour are out in 2015.

The PRess even left a comments thread open on their article about the tragic murder of the Leeds teacher. Extremely irresponsible.

Also, I think people get such an ego boost from bickering and arguing on comments threads, that it's never going to end.

No matter which political party you support, surely you do not want to see your local newspaper website filled with threads like this? And sadly, it spills over to non-council related stories. Positive, happy stories from our city are filled with 'the council are rubbish' comments.

Shame.
@yorkshirelad - Finally someone talking sense. Sadly, the Press word articles to get a reaction, and this will not change even if there is a change of council leaders in 2015 - The Press have realised inviting division, insults, arguing and at times hatred drives traffic to their website. That is not to say the council are not to blame for people's anger. At times they are. But it's turned into a circus. The Conservatives, LibDems, Greens and Labour will attack each other forever more, you can bet things will be exactly the same if Labour are out in 2015. The PRess even left a comments thread open on their article about the tragic murder of the Leeds teacher. Extremely irresponsible. Also, I think people get such an ego boost from bickering and arguing on comments threads, that it's never going to end. No matter which political party you support, surely you do not want to see your local newspaper website filled with threads like this? And sadly, it spills over to non-council related stories. Positive, happy stories from our city are filled with 'the council are rubbish' comments. Shame. York2000
  • Score: 29

5:08pm Tue 29 Apr 14

eeoodares says...

York2000 wrote:
@yorkshirelad - Finally someone talking sense.

Sadly, the Press word articles to get a reaction, and this will not change even if there is a change of council leaders in 2015 - The Press have realised inviting division, insults, arguing and at times hatred drives traffic to their website.

That is not to say the council are not to blame for people's anger. At times they are. But it's turned into a circus. The Conservatives, LibDems, Greens and Labour will attack each other forever more, you can bet things will be exactly the same if Labour are out in 2015.

The PRess even left a comments thread open on their article about the tragic murder of the Leeds teacher. Extremely irresponsible.

Also, I think people get such an ego boost from bickering and arguing on comments threads, that it's never going to end.

No matter which political party you support, surely you do not want to see your local newspaper website filled with threads like this? And sadly, it spills over to non-council related stories. Positive, happy stories from our city are filled with 'the council are rubbish' comments.

Shame.
Perhaps you do not get it. This council has set an agenda on a single point that cars are bad, they have made it difficult for residents, visitors and businesses to go about their day.

If you visit the personal blogs of the councillors, they are on anti-car panels and enthuse over their hatred for cars. They have imposed their vision for York without having a care if the population of the City is behind them. They are spending money they do not have and have made legally dubious decisions.

They have made decisions behind closed doors, they have refused debate, they have set trials without disclosing the key objectives or targets and then extended the trial in the face of huge opposition. A legal challenge was on the horizon and a U-turn was performed.

This council is a disgrace, it is not the Press causing the upset it is this lot. I have never been political in my life, but this lot should be kicked out now before they wreck this City!
[quote][p][bold]York2000[/bold] wrote: @yorkshirelad - Finally someone talking sense. Sadly, the Press word articles to get a reaction, and this will not change even if there is a change of council leaders in 2015 - The Press have realised inviting division, insults, arguing and at times hatred drives traffic to their website. That is not to say the council are not to blame for people's anger. At times they are. But it's turned into a circus. The Conservatives, LibDems, Greens and Labour will attack each other forever more, you can bet things will be exactly the same if Labour are out in 2015. The PRess even left a comments thread open on their article about the tragic murder of the Leeds teacher. Extremely irresponsible. Also, I think people get such an ego boost from bickering and arguing on comments threads, that it's never going to end. No matter which political party you support, surely you do not want to see your local newspaper website filled with threads like this? And sadly, it spills over to non-council related stories. Positive, happy stories from our city are filled with 'the council are rubbish' comments. Shame.[/p][/quote]Perhaps you do not get it. This council has set an agenda on a single point that cars are bad, they have made it difficult for residents, visitors and businesses to go about their day. If you visit the personal blogs of the councillors, they are on anti-car panels and enthuse over their hatred for cars. They have imposed their vision for York without having a care if the population of the City is behind them. They are spending money they do not have and have made legally dubious decisions. They have made decisions behind closed doors, they have refused debate, they have set trials without disclosing the key objectives or targets and then extended the trial in the face of huge opposition. A legal challenge was on the horizon and a U-turn was performed. This council is a disgrace, it is not the Press causing the upset it is this lot. I have never been political in my life, but this lot should be kicked out now before they wreck this City! eeoodares
  • Score: -29

6:22pm Tue 29 Apr 14

bjb says...

eeoodares wrote:
York2000 wrote:
@yorkshirelad - Finally someone talking sense.

Sadly, the Press word articles to get a reaction, and this will not change even if there is a change of council leaders in 2015 - The Press have realised inviting division, insults, arguing and at times hatred drives traffic to their website.

That is not to say the council are not to blame for people's anger. At times they are. But it's turned into a circus. The Conservatives, LibDems, Greens and Labour will attack each other forever more, you can bet things will be exactly the same if Labour are out in 2015.

The PRess even left a comments thread open on their article about the tragic murder of the Leeds teacher. Extremely irresponsible.

Also, I think people get such an ego boost from bickering and arguing on comments threads, that it's never going to end.

No matter which political party you support, surely you do not want to see your local newspaper website filled with threads like this? And sadly, it spills over to non-council related stories. Positive, happy stories from our city are filled with 'the council are rubbish' comments.

Shame.
Perhaps you do not get it. This council has set an agenda on a single point that cars are bad, they have made it difficult for residents, visitors and businesses to go about their day.

If you visit the personal blogs of the councillors, they are on anti-car panels and enthuse over their hatred for cars. They have imposed their vision for York without having a care if the population of the City is behind them. They are spending money they do not have and have made legally dubious decisions.

They have made decisions behind closed doors, they have refused debate, they have set trials without disclosing the key objectives or targets and then extended the trial in the face of huge opposition. A legal challenge was on the horizon and a U-turn was performed.

This council is a disgrace, it is not the Press causing the upset it is this lot. I have never been political in my life, but this lot should be kicked out now before they wreck this City!
You mean like the LibDems and Tories before them. They are all guilty of gross mismanagement and wasting public money.

This does not make them bad people, just people we elect to do a thankless job.

I would suspect that most of the Press comments trolls would never stand for elected office purely and simply because whatever decisions they had to make they would be hounded by trolls just like themselves.
[quote][p][bold]eeoodares[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]York2000[/bold] wrote: @yorkshirelad - Finally someone talking sense. Sadly, the Press word articles to get a reaction, and this will not change even if there is a change of council leaders in 2015 - The Press have realised inviting division, insults, arguing and at times hatred drives traffic to their website. That is not to say the council are not to blame for people's anger. At times they are. But it's turned into a circus. The Conservatives, LibDems, Greens and Labour will attack each other forever more, you can bet things will be exactly the same if Labour are out in 2015. The PRess even left a comments thread open on their article about the tragic murder of the Leeds teacher. Extremely irresponsible. Also, I think people get such an ego boost from bickering and arguing on comments threads, that it's never going to end. No matter which political party you support, surely you do not want to see your local newspaper website filled with threads like this? And sadly, it spills over to non-council related stories. Positive, happy stories from our city are filled with 'the council are rubbish' comments. Shame.[/p][/quote]Perhaps you do not get it. This council has set an agenda on a single point that cars are bad, they have made it difficult for residents, visitors and businesses to go about their day. If you visit the personal blogs of the councillors, they are on anti-car panels and enthuse over their hatred for cars. They have imposed their vision for York without having a care if the population of the City is behind them. They are spending money they do not have and have made legally dubious decisions. They have made decisions behind closed doors, they have refused debate, they have set trials without disclosing the key objectives or targets and then extended the trial in the face of huge opposition. A legal challenge was on the horizon and a U-turn was performed. This council is a disgrace, it is not the Press causing the upset it is this lot. I have never been political in my life, but this lot should be kicked out now before they wreck this City![/p][/quote]You mean like the LibDems and Tories before them. They are all guilty of gross mismanagement and wasting public money. This does not make them bad people, just people we elect to do a thankless job. I would suspect that most of the Press comments trolls would never stand for elected office purely and simply because whatever decisions they had to make they would be hounded by trolls just like themselves. bjb
  • Score: 33

8:40pm Tue 29 Apr 14

York2000 says...

eeoodares - The LibDem council before them were not exactly angels, and whoever takes over from Labour will be as petty and non-inclusive. That's how they work. Does that mean our local newspaper website has to be a hub for the Lib/La/Con/Green to bicker and argue? Surely not.

The Press word articles to whip up anger, they also use upper case in sentences to make their point. It's just cheap and you have to admit it's flooded our paper with arguing and nastiness.

Even we bicker... ;-)
eeoodares - The LibDem council before them were not exactly angels, and whoever takes over from Labour will be as petty and non-inclusive. That's how they work. Does that mean our local newspaper website has to be a hub for the Lib/La/Con/Green to bicker and argue? Surely not. The Press word articles to whip up anger, they also use upper case in sentences to make their point. It's just cheap and you have to admit it's flooded our paper with arguing and nastiness. Even we bicker... ;-) York2000
  • Score: 1

10:33pm Tue 29 Apr 14

MorkofYork says...

As long as whoever takes over isn't trying to ram their ideology down my throat i'll be happy.
As long as whoever takes over isn't trying to ram their ideology down my throat i'll be happy. MorkofYork
  • Score: 1

10:42pm Tue 29 Apr 14

bjb says...

MorkofYork wrote:
As long as whoever takes over isn't trying to ram their ideology down my throat i'll be happy.
Sorry but you will remain unhappy. Politics either local or nationally is about ideology. Like it or not that is the way it is. Be it right wing or left wing or even UKIP there will be those who agree or oppose. What is not in doubt is that the Press will seek to tabloid the issues to increase the hits to this site and encourage the trolls.
[quote][p][bold]MorkofYork[/bold] wrote: As long as whoever takes over isn't trying to ram their ideology down my throat i'll be happy.[/p][/quote]Sorry but you will remain unhappy. Politics either local or nationally is about ideology. Like it or not that is the way it is. Be it right wing or left wing or even UKIP there will be those who agree or oppose. What is not in doubt is that the Press will seek to tabloid the issues to increase the hits to this site and encourage the trolls. bjb
  • Score: 0

11:27pm Tue 29 Apr 14

MorkofYork says...

I don't think so. I don't mind people doing things to tackle problems on a case by case basis, but when they start trying to drive through their "vision" that is incompatible with the masses and myself we have a problem.

They and their supporters are generally not likable, they even have people manipulating the scores here. It's disgusting.

20's plenty brought me here, when the green nuts have gone i'll be happy.
I don't think so. I don't mind people doing things to tackle problems on a case by case basis, but when they start trying to drive through their "vision" that is incompatible with the masses and myself we have a problem. They and their supporters are generally not likable, they even have people manipulating the scores here. It's disgusting. 20's plenty brought me here, when the green nuts have gone i'll be happy. MorkofYork
  • Score: -55

3:59am Wed 30 Apr 14

Magicman! says...

I wonder, does Anna Semleyn go and do her shopping in York first thing on a thursday/friday/satu
rday...?

anyay:
"It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite," he said.

"They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green and were critical of us trying to remove the purple of ftr bus off our streets after how much money they had wasted on both schemes when they ran the council."

It is statements that get me annoyed at politics.
The FTR bus did NOT go from York's streets purely as a political measure - the buses dissappeared because Tower Street was to close and there are issues taking bendy buses in service along Coppergate; this is in addition to the FTR project across the UK as a whole having failed and been a commercial flop so was axed nationwide.

Reintroducing the left filter lane at Clifton Green was simply beyond belief and was done only because they had promised it to win the votes from the motoring brigade... if we remember, every single professional body (including the Police) that had anything to do with roads clearly stated the left turn lane should NOT be reinstated - and this followed from a public consultation which came back as 70% saying to leave the cycle lane in place; and knowing the reinstatement of the filter lane wouldn't reduce congestion, because the motoring lobby had clearly forgotten the length of traffic queues before the cycle lane was ever put in in the first place, the council tampered with the traffic lights on the sly - adding extra time to Water End, which now means Shipton Road spend much longer time on red and so the long traffic queues are now there in addition to Water End.

There is an old saying that if you put enough monkeys in a room with typewriters and left them long enough, they would write the works of Shakespeare... well I think if we got 10 chimps in the guildhall and left them for a week, they'd come up with a much better transport policiy than the current "play it by ear" policy this council has adopted!!!
I wonder, does Anna Semleyn go and do her shopping in York first thing on a thursday/friday/satu rday...? anyay: [quote] "It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite," he said. "They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green and were critical of us trying to remove the purple of ftr bus off our streets after how much money they had wasted on both schemes when they ran the council." [/quote] It is statements that get me annoyed at politics. The FTR bus did NOT go from York's streets purely as a political measure - the buses dissappeared because Tower Street was to close and there are issues taking bendy buses in service along Coppergate; this is in addition to the FTR project across the UK as a whole having failed and been a commercial flop so was axed nationwide. Reintroducing the left filter lane at Clifton Green was simply beyond belief and was done only because they had promised it to win the votes from the motoring brigade... if we remember, every single professional body (including the Police) that had anything to do with roads clearly stated the left turn lane should NOT be reinstated - and this followed from a public consultation which came back as 70% saying to leave the cycle lane in place; and knowing the reinstatement of the filter lane wouldn't reduce congestion, because the motoring lobby had clearly forgotten the length of traffic queues before the cycle lane was ever put in in the first place, the council tampered with the traffic lights on the sly - adding extra time to Water End, which now means Shipton Road spend much longer time on red and so the long traffic queues are now there in addition to Water End. There is an old saying that if you put enough monkeys in a room with typewriters and left them long enough, they would write the works of Shakespeare... well I think if we got 10 chimps in the guildhall and left them for a week, they'd come up with a much better transport policiy than the current "play it by ear" policy this council has adopted!!! Magicman!
  • Score: 1

10:55am Wed 30 Apr 14

eeoodares says...

York2000 wrote:
eeoodares - The LibDem council before them were not exactly angels, and whoever takes over from Labour will be as petty and non-inclusive. That's how they work. Does that mean our local newspaper website has to be a hub for the Lib/La/Con/Green to bicker and argue? Surely not.

The Press word articles to whip up anger, they also use upper case in sentences to make their point. It's just cheap and you have to admit it's flooded our paper with arguing and nastiness.

Even we bicker... ;-)
If you are saying that The Press is inventing dories to 'whip up' anger then prove it, if you are saying that they are reporting the news...that is what they are there for! If the Council are not acting in the best interests of the residents and businesses of York then that will create anger. To blame The Press for that is unrealistic!
[quote][p][bold]York2000[/bold] wrote: eeoodares - The LibDem council before them were not exactly angels, and whoever takes over from Labour will be as petty and non-inclusive. That's how they work. Does that mean our local newspaper website has to be a hub for the Lib/La/Con/Green to bicker and argue? Surely not. The Press word articles to whip up anger, they also use upper case in sentences to make their point. It's just cheap and you have to admit it's flooded our paper with arguing and nastiness. Even we bicker... ;-)[/p][/quote]If you are saying that The Press is inventing dories to 'whip up' anger then prove it, if you are saying that they are reporting the news...that is what they are there for! If the Council are not acting in the best interests of the residents and businesses of York then that will create anger. To blame The Press for that is unrealistic! eeoodares
  • Score: 2

9:59am Thu 1 May 14

m dee says...

This scheme is about filling empty parking spaces and using income from the MX development to fund this.
If this was to help Business and residents please tell me where are all the shops are that will be open at 8am this is when the City is chock a block with delivery vehicles.
This scheme is about filling empty parking spaces and using income from the MX development to fund this. If this was to help Business and residents please tell me where are all the shops are that will be open at 8am this is when the City is chock a block with delivery vehicles. m dee
  • Score: 4

12:20pm Thu 1 May 14

greenmonkey says...

Magicman! wrote:
I wonder, does Anna Semleyn go and do her shopping in York first thing on a thursday/friday/satu

rday...?

anyay:
"It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite," he said.

"They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green and were critical of us trying to remove the purple of ftr bus off our streets after how much money they had wasted on both schemes when they ran the council."

It is statements that get me annoyed at politics.
The FTR bus did NOT go from York's streets purely as a political measure - the buses dissappeared because Tower Street was to close and there are issues taking bendy buses in service along Coppergate; this is in addition to the FTR project across the UK as a whole having failed and been a commercial flop so was axed nationwide.

Reintroducing the left filter lane at Clifton Green was simply beyond belief and was done only because they had promised it to win the votes from the motoring brigade... if we remember, every single professional body (including the Police) that had anything to do with roads clearly stated the left turn lane should NOT be reinstated - and this followed from a public consultation which came back as 70% saying to leave the cycle lane in place; and knowing the reinstatement of the filter lane wouldn't reduce congestion, because the motoring lobby had clearly forgotten the length of traffic queues before the cycle lane was ever put in in the first place, the council tampered with the traffic lights on the sly - adding extra time to Water End, which now means Shipton Road spend much longer time on red and so the long traffic queues are now there in addition to Water End.

There is an old saying that if you put enough monkeys in a room with typewriters and left them long enough, they would write the works of Shakespeare... well I think if we got 10 chimps in the guildhall and left them for a week, they'd come up with a much better transport policiy than the current "play it by ear" policy this council has adopted!!!
A lot I agree with here! And by the way "Maybe you could tell us how you came to claim in a radio interview that your manifesto had included a promise to remove the cycle lane, when no such promise was to be found in the document?" is very pertinent - Labour's manifesto leaftet only referred to providing cycle lanes 'where they are needed' and Labour were quoted in the Press before the lane was installed criticising the Lib Dems for not introducing it sooner! The sad part of the U turn on Clifton Green cycle lane is that Merrett probably did it with the Lendal Bridge trial in mind (to provide alternative capacity on Water Lane), but all it achieved was a precedent that public and opposition pressure could force a u - turn which was used to full effect when the botched signage and implementation (of lendal bridge) became apparent.
[quote][p][bold]Magicman![/bold] wrote: I wonder, does Anna Semleyn go and do her shopping in York first thing on a thursday/friday/satu rday...? anyay: [quote] "It is a shame the Liberal Democrats believe they know best and want to stop Labour from introducing such a scheme - presumably for party political spite," he said. "They tried this same tactic to stop us reintroducing the left hand filter lane at Clifton Green and were critical of us trying to remove the purple of ftr bus off our streets after how much money they had wasted on both schemes when they ran the council." [/quote] It is statements that get me annoyed at politics. The FTR bus did NOT go from York's streets purely as a political measure - the buses dissappeared because Tower Street was to close and there are issues taking bendy buses in service along Coppergate; this is in addition to the FTR project across the UK as a whole having failed and been a commercial flop so was axed nationwide. Reintroducing the left filter lane at Clifton Green was simply beyond belief and was done only because they had promised it to win the votes from the motoring brigade... if we remember, every single professional body (including the Police) that had anything to do with roads clearly stated the left turn lane should NOT be reinstated - and this followed from a public consultation which came back as 70% saying to leave the cycle lane in place; and knowing the reinstatement of the filter lane wouldn't reduce congestion, because the motoring lobby had clearly forgotten the length of traffic queues before the cycle lane was ever put in in the first place, the council tampered with the traffic lights on the sly - adding extra time to Water End, which now means Shipton Road spend much longer time on red and so the long traffic queues are now there in addition to Water End. There is an old saying that if you put enough monkeys in a room with typewriters and left them long enough, they would write the works of Shakespeare... well I think if we got 10 chimps in the guildhall and left them for a week, they'd come up with a much better transport policiy than the current "play it by ear" policy this council has adopted!!![/p][/quote]A lot I agree with here! And by the way "Maybe you could tell us how you came to claim in a radio interview that your manifesto had included a promise to remove the cycle lane, when no such promise was to be found in the document?" is very pertinent - Labour's manifesto leaftet only referred to providing cycle lanes 'where they are needed' and Labour were quoted in the Press before the lane was installed criticising the Lib Dems for not introducing it sooner! The sad part of the U turn on Clifton Green cycle lane is that Merrett probably did it with the Lendal Bridge trial in mind (to provide alternative capacity on Water Lane), but all it achieved was a precedent that public and opposition pressure could force a u - turn which was used to full effect when the botched signage and implementation (of lendal bridge) became apparent. greenmonkey
  • Score: 0

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